- yes
- no
- test on a few maps
0 voters
just put a few maps with 9 vils into map pool to check results, why not?
pros already have fun with it on tourney it’s our turn, is it?
1 Like
6 vils take 150 in-game seconds to train. that’s less than 2 real-life minutes.
pro’s can push deer and scout with 3 vil start, most people can’t.
1 Like
No, that is not AoE2.
Dark age should be expanded not simplified.
5 Likes
While I could agree with you, how do you expand it without get so close to Feudal age to make worth to keep it?
1 Like
While I could agree with you, how do you expand it without get so close to Feudal age to make worth to keep it?
Difficult question, changes have many consequences, so I can only mention some ideas, I don’t really know what is best.
But what I see and don’t like is that people go for very tight build orders to more or less just skip dark age, what is imo not the idea of the dark age.
Ideas are
- Longer research time for feudal age
- Higher cost for feudal age
- Buff for Militia like +1 damage against standard buildings
- Changed gathering rate for hunting
- Changed amount of food on huntable animals
- Map changes like different amount and position of deer.
But things have also an effect on feudal age, so it is difficult to say what the effects of changes are. I also see the downside of big changes like making feudal age more expensive, that it would confuse peoples knowledge about fundamental parts of the game, what is not desireable.
2 Likes
Well, I was expected something more interesting. Except the +1 vs building for militia, the rest of the ideas just make the most boring age lasts longer instead of make it more interesting.
With more time in dark age, i guess you only will push all games into drush+FC, or even straight FC into knights.
I guess boring dark age is something that we have to asume as it is.
3 Likes
Not aoe2?? Regicide cof cof
3 Likes
Maybe some changes could make dark age more interesting:
-move huntable animals far away from TCs and add more packs of huntables spreaded for the map
-Add more predators.
-reduce bushes number close to TC and add busheas spreaded for the map.
-reduce herdables close to TC but add packs of herdables spreaded for the map.
-reduce mill, lumber and mining camp base cost to half, or even more. Like a house cost.
-Farm base cost from 60 to 100W
-Horse collar reduce farms cost to 60W
-Barracks cost reduced to 100W (nerf hp and armor if neccesary)
These changes all togheter could force players to take an strategic decision. Could stay safe in base with expensive farms or go explore the maps looking for hunting, herdables or bushes.
This could make map controlling in feudal even more rewarding.
This would only work on Fast Castle maps like Arena, Black Forest, Team Islands etc. If you want a fast start on open maps, you need to play EW.
1 Like
This would be a big nerf to Japanese.
Nah, I don’t like this. You’d be stuck in Feudal too long waiting for enough wood to build farms. Unless you’re going scouts, horse collar is usually something you get on the way up to castle age.
1 Like
I was expecting everything:
- grandpas afraid of new meta\build orders.
- people use this time to go make some coffee
- people prefer number 3 over 9.
but I never expected - people voting “no”, with ideas COMPLETELY rework the dark age. ROFL
same as storytelling dreams…obviously devs will never do it…want voting for dreams - make another thread.
Worked fine in tourneys…people come with question, how it’s 20 pop on 5 minute, without realising the difference.
never heard “bad reviews” from pros. on the contrary, some doubted, but changed their minds after.
I am more watcher now, than a player… and without changes to make the start more dynamic, nothing will change. (btw TG player and the feeling of same 10 minutes again and again…just why?! )
my I guess devs need\can launch a few maps with 9 vils (make it clear about 9), who does not want- will just ban them
And collect metrics: how many will decide to try\return\ban or prefer.
Then as a viewer, you’re in no position to be making changes and dictating to us players how to play the game
We already have a limited number of bans as it is. Why should we have to waste bans on 9 villager maps?
You don’t like 3 vil start? Play empire wars. It’s literally an entire game mode for people who don’t like slow starts. Stop messing with the fundamental game structure; it’s the bread and butter of the game. Standard start has ALWAYS been 3 villagers + TC + scout (or just 3 villagers for Nomad) since the game first began over 20 years ago. The sheer arrogance here is astounding.
1 Like
reread sentence. you are nobody to tell me what to do and what to not do. I’ve probably spend more hours in aoe2 than you’ve lived.
launch the game. it’s 3 vils for last 25 years =\
the arrogant one here is only you.
Arrogant because I like the game the way it is and don’t think the most popular game settings should be changed? How does that even make sense? I conceded that 9 villager start would be OK only on fast castle maps? How is that arrogant?
Whereas you think the game should change to suit your minority tastes. Sorry, but that is arrogance.
Hah, that’s literally impossible. 
I’ve been playing the game on and off since the early 2000s.
1 Like
Yes, I though about it but you can put creative and think another similar bonus (just for fun, assuming that my list of changes would be implementend how it is), like start with X wood, or just buff the 50% discount, or make huntables give 15% more food (to offset the rotten food). Is not like this idea is completely bad because nerf only one civ.
I thought it too, but I don’t think it would be a problem. Just horse collar will become a mandatory tech as soon as you reach feudal like doublebit axe. THink that you will save a lot of wood and have more food because of hunting.
Another thing that could happen is that scouts become really common used. For this,spearmen could be available in barracks from dark age. Is not crazy anyway, taking in count that they are the most basic military unit… historically.
Japanese could use a bit of a flavour change, in my opinion. They’ve always felt pretty bland to me, having pretty much no military bonuses in late feudal-early imperial, when infantry play is less than viable.
I voted to test it on a few maps. I think it would work better on closed maps than open ones, especially on Arena, where there’s less scouting to do. I think it should be a feature of the maps though – i.e. don’t just change Arena to have 9 villagers, make a different map with a different name with 9 villagers.
I think it’s not that surprising – they’re suggesting alternative ways to address the problem that you’re presumably trying to solve. (Although you didn’t actually say what that problem was.)
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When everyone realizes that everyone else has been playing the game since it came out, it’s the spiderman pointing meme except replaced by monks because everyone’s a dinosaur. I have the book that tells me there’s no such thing as Halberdier or Hussar because I played the game when it came out too, so I claim victory in this discussion.
It’s weird to see the appeal to authority fallacy being used to refer to self so often, and this is basically the only place I get to see it.
On the actual subject, if they threw a couple specific maps that had 9-vill on it, that wouldn’t be so bad. We have maps with multiple TC starts, so what does it matter if they have a map or two that have a 9-vill? Beyond that, definitely not. You would be penalizing players who do not practice a 9-vill start as all the timings are just completely wrong. It’s cool as long as it’s a map-distinct thing, once it gets away from that we have a problem.
3 Likes
I do see some potential in 9 vill starts. Dark age is by far the most boring and repetitive age of all to me. Skipping a small part of this (6 vills is about 2.5 minutes) sounds great.
1 Like
I don’t know about a 9 vill start, it seems a bit too different to really qualify as the same game mode.
I’d be down for maps that encourage very different dark ages, though. The big problem with Dark Age is that it’s basically just a rote recital test; you do exactly the same things almost every time. All the dark age tends to do with most players is sometimes get a villager killed to a boar or a wolf, which heavily biases the game right in the beginning through something that is often just the result of bad luck.
I’m imagining a map that forces players together early on, like a sort of food-based golden pit. Imagine you only start with like 2 berry bushes, and in the center of the map is loads of berries and deer, but also wolves. Something like that.
2 Likes