A more standardised counter system

[FourCloud176402]

Why not just make Assault Infantry (Grenadier-like units) and Heavy Cavalry (Cuirassiers-like units) Home City only units? This way, the units can be redesigned to be more powerful while staying somewhat outside the counter system.

Sure, they may not have hard counters, but they are also limited in numbers.

[coffeeco01]

@FourCloud176402

Heavy Cavalry (Cuirassiers-like units) Home City only units?

then you have the sapahi and as with most otto units opions are still pretty mixed

[FourCloud176402]

The problem with here is not just the Sipahi, but also that:

• the rest of the Ottoman roster is significantly better (Deli, Azap, Abus, Humbaraci, etc.)
• the Ottoman economy needs less micro (for villager production)

At this point, the Ottoman military needs a bit of an overall nerf, as most of their unit are arguably “OP” in the current counter system. Most glaringly, Azap fills both the role of pikeman and crossbowman. This breaks the counter system more than Sipahi.

[MatM1996]

@Inocybe2755

Is it from an official source or did you made it ? very nice graph

I created a graphic showing basic unit counters

Been getting some friends to play the game with me. A lot of them have trouble learning what counters what, so I decided to make a graphic to help them out - figured this would be helpful for ya’ll too. Note that this graphic is meant to depict “basic” counters - it doesn’t capture all unit types in the game. And some of these counters may not work depending on the situation/unit. For instance, while light cavalry generally trades unfavorably with heavy infantry, some micro could allow the ligh…

It’s from this post…

@Silenos7315

it’s what already exists in the game but it leaves out weird units like grenadiers, culverins or lancers

Yes, it doesn’t change much anyway…the grenadiers are heavy infantry like musk and piks/halbs; culverins are anti-inf and anti-artillery, and the lancers are heavy cavalry like the hussars…

@hamletlopez

Grenadiers are heavy infantry [can be counter with artillery, skimirsher, cav or combination of them]
Culverins are artillery effective only to other artillery. Can be countered by itself or by combining cav + light cav

Exactly…

@Jamesagraham5

I made my little chart in a rush but wanted to show some of the other counters not explored in the official chart. Such as what Grenadiers and Halberdiers should counter.

I also just wanted to show how confusing the current counter system is at the moment. What a mess!!!

Yes, no problem…

@FourCloud176402

• the rest of the Ottoman roster is significantly better (Deli, Azap, Abus, Humbaraci, etc.)

@FourCloud176402

At this point, the Ottoman military needs a bit of an overall nerf, as most of their unit are arguably “OP” in the current counter system. Most glaringly, Azap fills both the role of pikeman and crossbowman. This breaks the counter system more than Sipahi.

Yes, I leave the Ottomans out, since they have their unique roster of units like the other non-European civs in the game…

[Ekdal1378]

And we all know what a mess of balance that units are