About V&V... Creators remuneration

As I recall, some of the official skirmish maps were originally made by a modder before they were added as an official map. I don’t know what the protocols are (hopefully they contact the creator and get permission before making it official). But personally, if one of my custom rms scripts were to become an official map, I think I’d be thrilled (it would indicate that my map is high-quality, and would make it eligible for ranked gameplay, and generally make it a more-played map). Either way though, the maps are available to anyone with the base game.

Sometimes the former, sometimes some other reason. Money doesn’t usually come into it since modders generally don’t get paid (there are occasionally map contests for tournament rms scripts with monetary rewards, but they’re infrequent and generally small). I don’t know about other types of mods, but I don’t expect they’d have more opportunities (might not even have that much). But if your goal is money, then you wouldn’t be making unofficial mods (rather, you’d get an actual paying job - like one making official DLCs for a game)

It’s a bit like open-source software and other forms of volunteer work - it’s something you do on your own time, and isn’t something that you do for money.

As far as I understand, if it’s uploaded to the mods, then it’s MS intellectual property because of the TOS. So MS shouldn’t need to acquire any permission.

YMMV but I think upcycling mods to make free content is different than upcycling mods to make paid content.

Yes, yes, any and all content is something you technically have to pay for. Even if it’s added to the base aoe2:DE you had to pay for DE so you paid for it retroactively, or someone new will have to pay for DE. Pedantry aside, upcycling a mod and adding it to the game for free I feel is different than upcycling a mod and putting it behind a paywall.

To me one says “hey, this is so good this should just be a part of the game, I wish I’d thought of it first” the other says “hey, we could make money with less effort by using someone else’s work and creativity as a starting point”.

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So actually if you check out his linkdin, he left FE in 2020, went to blizzard for two years, then went to worlds edge.

So he didn’t return to FE, but he did return to working on AoE.

Well Worlds Edge didn’t exist in 2020, did it?

But yeah, he left Microsoft to join a company that was bought my Microsoft, funny irony.
I wonder if he was just “moved” internally, lol.

world’s edge was created in 2019.

Blizzard wasn’t acquired by MS until 2023, after filthy moved to worlds edge.

So yeah, filthy left for a while, but came back to MS to work on Aoe2 again.

You can. It’s called YouTube, streaming, or game journalism.

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Getting paid for ads, or writing, isn’t the same as me getting paid for playing a game of my choice. Let’s not be obtuse now, eh?

Game tester? Also, proGaming.

Yeah, now you’re listing jobs that require contracts, etc. Not hobbies.

People can get paid for their hobbies: sports people, actors, musicians…

A job is still a job. What’s the point you’re making, exactly?

Can modders get paid for their work? In theory, assuming they’re not falling foul of any legal issues, sure. It’s generally hard to see modders turning this into a paid job because by default this will cause legal issues.

“modding” isn’t a job in of itself. Neither is playing a musical instrument. Being a salaried games developer is a job. Being a professional musician is a job. All these things that require contracts, billable hours or set wages . . . everything that modding doesn’t have, because it’s a hobby.

That you can get paid for playing a game of your choice. As a game tester or a progamer. Those are jobs that require contracts, but that’s not the opposite of getting paid for playing a game of your choice. Both can be true at the same time

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That you can (technically) get paid for playing a game still doesn’t mean that it’s the same thing.

Why are you being so pedantic? I mean, you’re still wrong, because most games don’t have a “pro” scene (and these often require mechanical skill that not everyone has, even with training), and game testers do not “play” games in the conventional sense (and definitely not the game of your choice).

But what’s the discussion here? What are we trying to prove? I’m a software developer and games modder, lol. I’ve also done QA. Playing the same scenario ten times over to write a report on the bugs in said scenario is not “playing the game” :sweat_smile:

Why are you being so pedantic? You CAN get paid. That’s the only thing I’m saying. Let’s not be obtuse.

Anyways, I’m done here

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