# Balance sugestions for May patch **URL:** \ **Category:** II - Discussion\ **Created:** [May 9, 2020, 6:44pm UTC](https://forums.ageofempires.com/t/balance-sugestions-for-may-patch/81845 "2020-05-09T18:44:35Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 10
**Author:** ![JonOli12](https://forums.ageofempires.com/user_avatar/forums.ageofempires.com/jonoli12/32/50441_2.png) [@JonOli12](https://forums.ageofempires.com/u/JonOli12)\ **Post date:** [May 24, 2020, 5:51pm UTC](https://forums.ageofempires.com/t/balance-sugestions-for-may-patch/81845/194 "2020-05-24T17:51:04Z")
> **[Lithuanians](https://aoestats.io/civ/lithuanians/rm_1v1/)** > > Detailed statistics, including win rate and play rate, on the Lithuanians civilization in Age of Empires II in the 1v1 Random Map ladder across all Elo. Current win rate: 51.56% Lithuanians on all data, over 10k games, 51.56% winrate. Not Op, no need for nerfs, of any kind. ---
**Author:** ![CactusSteak2171](https://forums.ageofempires.com/user_avatar/forums.ageofempires.com/cactussteak2171/32/29684_2.png) [@CactusSteak2171](https://forums.ageofempires.com/u/CactusSteak2171)\ **Post date:** [May 24, 2020, 7:33pm UTC](https://forums.ageofempires.com/t/balance-sugestions-for-may-patch/81845/195 "2020-05-24T19:33:07Z")
> [@Szebo210](#): > > No way Leitis should be left unchanged Well when Battle of Africa wwas still played on the current patch Lithuanian weren’t overused or anything as they would have if Leitis were too strong. ---
**Author:** ![Lonezwiebel](https://forums.ageofempires.com/user_avatar/forums.ageofempires.com/lonezwiebel/32/29843_2.png) [@Lonezwiebel](https://forums.ageofempires.com/u/Lonezwiebel)\ **Post date:** [May 24, 2020, 8:41pm UTC](https://forums.ageofempires.com/t/balance-sugestions-for-may-patch/81845/196 "2020-05-24T20:41:55Z")
Indian get nerfed in the last patch. So it’s just fair and in my opinion maybe not enough. I’m playing with Leitis several times and they are really OP. Combined with skirmishers against Pikes you don’t have any chance against Leitis. ---
**Author:** ![CactusSteak2171](https://forums.ageofempires.com/user_avatar/forums.ageofempires.com/cactussteak2171/32/29684_2.png) [@CactusSteak2171](https://forums.ageofempires.com/u/CactusSteak2171)\ **Post date:** [May 24, 2020, 11:21pm UTC](https://forums.ageofempires.com/t/balance-sugestions-for-may-patch/81845/197 "2020-05-24T23:21:48Z")
> [@Lonezwiebel](#): > > Indian get nerfed in the last patch It wasn’t really a nerf, just an adjustment to prevent Indian from becoming OP because of the new dock drop-off mechanic. ---
**Author:** ![MatCauthon3](https://forums.ageofempires.com/user_avatar/forums.ageofempires.com/matcauthon3/32/29474_2.png) [@MatCauthon3](https://forums.ageofempires.com/u/MatCauthon3)\ **Post date:** [May 24, 2020, 11:29pm UTC](https://forums.ageofempires.com/t/balance-sugestions-for-may-patch/81845/198 "2020-05-24T23:29:08Z")
> [@Lonezwiebel](#): > > Indian get nerfed in the last patch. > So it’s just fair and in my opinion maybe not enough. > > I’m playing with Leitis several times and they are really OP. Combined with skirmishers against Pikes you don’t have any chance against Leitis. Did you read why they got that nerf? Its because of the dock shore fish change. Food for thought, the only two civs that had bonuses that help them boom, and also have elephants got nerfed last patch. Onagers + pikes of your own would wreck that composition. ---
**Author:** ![JonOli12](https://forums.ageofempires.com/user_avatar/forums.ageofempires.com/jonoli12/32/50441_2.png) [@JonOli12](https://forums.ageofempires.com/u/JonOli12)\ **Post date:** [May 24, 2020, 11:38pm UTC](https://forums.ageofempires.com/t/balance-sugestions-for-may-patch/81845/199 "2020-05-24T23:38:04Z")
Depends on how he micros the Leitis, actually. They do goi through Onagers something Fierce. Not to mention taht he will have more Leitis, than you will have Onagers. That being said, Leitis are still not an OP unit, and any civ with decent Halbs, boosted Pikes or Heavy Camels, will just destroy Leitis. ---
**Author:** ![CactusSteak2171](https://forums.ageofempires.com/user_avatar/forums.ageofempires.com/cactussteak2171/32/29684_2.png) [@CactusSteak2171](https://forums.ageofempires.com/u/CactusSteak2171)\ **Post date:** [May 24, 2020, 11:55pm UTC](https://forums.ageofempires.com/t/balance-sugestions-for-may-patch/81845/200 "2020-05-24T23:55:18Z")
> [@MatCauthon3](#): > > Onagers + pikes of your own would wreck that composition. Lith get BBC tho. > [@JonOli12](#): > > They do goi through Onagers something Fierce Well ignoring armour isn’t useful against a unit that has none, so you would be better of with the pala’s extra HP if you want a gold unit ofr this job. ---
**Author:** ![MatCauthon3](https://forums.ageofempires.com/user_avatar/forums.ageofempires.com/matcauthon3/32/29474_2.png) [@MatCauthon3](https://forums.ageofempires.com/u/MatCauthon3)\ **Post date:** [May 24, 2020, 11:57pm UTC](https://forums.ageofempires.com/t/balance-sugestions-for-may-patch/81845/201 "2020-05-24T23:57:04Z")
> [@CactusSteak2171](#): > > Lith get BBC tho. then people who want to nerf the Leitis can suggest a buff to make sure their winrate doesn’t fall to unfavorable levels. ---
**Author:** ![JonOli12](https://forums.ageofempires.com/user_avatar/forums.ageofempires.com/jonoli12/32/50441_2.png) [@JonOli12](https://forums.ageofempires.com/u/JonOli12)\ **Post date:** [May 25, 2020, 12:36am UTC](https://forums.ageofempires.com/t/balance-sugestions-for-may-patch/81845/202 "2020-05-25T00:36:49Z")
Paladins are heaps more expensive to field, though. ---
**Author:** ![JoJo9942](https://forums.ageofempires.com/user_avatar/forums.ageofempires.com/jojo9942/32/50595_2.png) [@JoJo9942](https://forums.ageofempires.com/u/JoJo9942)\ **Post date:** [May 25, 2020, 5:23am UTC](https://forums.ageofempires.com/t/balance-sugestions-for-may-patch/81845/203 "2020-05-25T05:23:38Z")
Not all of the shorefish maps were dockable tho so it was a nerf ---
**Author:** ![Szebo210](https://forums.ageofempires.com/user_avatar/forums.ageofempires.com/szebo210/32/45427_2.png) [@Szebo210](https://forums.ageofempires.com/u/Szebo210)\ **Post date:** [May 25, 2020, 6:11am UTC](https://forums.ageofempires.com/t/balance-sugestions-for-may-patch/81845/204 "2020-05-25T06:11:36Z")
> [@CactusSteak2171](#): > > Well when Battle of Africa wwas still played on the current patch Lithuanian weren’t overused or anything as they would have if Leitis were too strong. Only 1 match was played on the current patch and like half of the maps didnt have stone so even if it had stone that wouldn’t mean much. Depends on the match. ---
**Author:** ![Szebo210](https://forums.ageofempires.com/user_avatar/forums.ageofempires.com/szebo210/32/45427_2.png) [@Szebo210](https://forums.ageofempires.com/u/Szebo210)\ **Post date:** [May 25, 2020, 6:14am UTC](https://forums.ageofempires.com/t/balance-sugestions-for-may-patch/81845/205 "2020-05-25T06:14:33Z")
> [@MatCauthon3](#): > > then people who want to nerf the Leitis can suggest a buff to make sure their winrate doesn’t fall to unfavorable levels. That’s not how it works and stop agruing with the winrate please! ---
**Author:** ![Bzhydack](https://forums.ageofempires.com/user_avatar/forums.ageofempires.com/bzhydack/32/50401_2.png) [@Bzhydack](https://forums.ageofempires.com/u/Bzhydack)\ **Post date:** [May 25, 2020, 7:17am UTC](https://forums.ageofempires.com/t/balance-sugestions-for-may-patch/81845/206 "2020-05-25T07:17:28Z")
Easy. Give them Partian Tactics, allowing them to have FU CA. ---
**Author:** ![MatCauthon3](https://forums.ageofempires.com/user_avatar/forums.ageofempires.com/matcauthon3/32/29474_2.png) [@MatCauthon3](https://forums.ageofempires.com/u/MatCauthon3)\ **Post date:** [May 25, 2020, 7:18am UTC](https://forums.ageofempires.com/t/balance-sugestions-for-may-patch/81845/207 "2020-05-25T07:18:10Z")
> [@Szebo210](#): > > > [@MatCauthon3](#): > > > > then people who want to nerf the Leitis can suggest a buff to make sure their winrate doesn’t fall to unfavorable levels. > > That’s not how it works and stop agruing with the winrate please! First of all, yes it is. You’re not nerfing Lithuanians because you feel Lithuanians are too strong. You’re nerfing the leitis because its too strong. Meanwhile Lithuanians are sitting right at the balanced spot. How were Lithuanians doing pre buff to the leitis? They were absolute crap. So yes, if you’re going to nerf the only thing keeping Lithuanians good, you need to keep in mind what it will do to balance. Its not just high level winrates. Lithuanians aren’t overbearing in tournaments either. They are also balanced if you use all levels elo ---
**Author:** ![MatCauthon3](https://forums.ageofempires.com/user_avatar/forums.ageofempires.com/matcauthon3/32/29474_2.png) [@MatCauthon3](https://forums.ageofempires.com/u/MatCauthon3)\ **Post date:** [May 25, 2020, 7:20am UTC](https://forums.ageofempires.com/t/balance-sugestions-for-may-patch/81845/208 "2020-05-25T07:20:38Z")
> [@Bzhydack](#): > > Easy. > Give them Partian Tactics, allowing them to have FU CA. I dont really like the idea of turning lithuanians into another paladin + hca civ, but it would work. ---
**Author:** ![Bzhydack](https://forums.ageofempires.com/user_avatar/forums.ageofempires.com/bzhydack/32/50401_2.png) [@Bzhydack](https://forums.ageofempires.com/u/Bzhydack)\ **Post date:** [May 25, 2020, 7:25am UTC](https://forums.ageofempires.com/t/balance-sugestions-for-may-patch/81845/209 "2020-05-25T07:25:56Z")
Liths have identity as civ with fast-moving army (Cav, fast skirms, fast pikes, almost no siege), HCA will be very good addition to that. ---
**Author:** ![JoJo9942](https://forums.ageofempires.com/user_avatar/forums.ageofempires.com/jojo9942/32/50595_2.png) [@JoJo9942](https://forums.ageofempires.com/u/JoJo9942)\ **Post date:** [May 25, 2020, 7:26am UTC](https://forums.ageofempires.com/t/balance-sugestions-for-may-patch/81845/210 "2020-05-25T07:26:02Z")
another? Its not a common combo with the investment and cost, giving them parthian tactics back will make a theme of all Khan civs having PT ---
**Author:** ![MatCauthon3](https://forums.ageofempires.com/user_avatar/forums.ageofempires.com/matcauthon3/32/29474_2.png) [@MatCauthon3](https://forums.ageofempires.com/u/MatCauthon3)\ **Post date:** [May 25, 2020, 7:27am UTC](https://forums.ageofempires.com/t/balance-sugestions-for-may-patch/81845/211 "2020-05-25T07:27:29Z")
> [@Bzhydack](#): > > Liths have identity as civ with fast-moving army (Cav, fast skirms, fast pikes, almost no siege), HCA will be very good addition to that. > [@JoJo9942](#): > > another? Its not a common combo with the investment and cost, giving them parthian tactics back will make a theme of all Khan civs having PT Very true. I honestly don’t think the leitis needs a nerf though. ---
**Author:** ![Bzhydack](https://forums.ageofempires.com/user_avatar/forums.ageofempires.com/bzhydack/32/50401_2.png) [@Bzhydack](https://forums.ageofempires.com/u/Bzhydack)\ **Post date:** [May 25, 2020, 7:27am UTC](https://forums.ageofempires.com/t/balance-sugestions-for-may-patch/81845/212 "2020-05-25T07:27:56Z")
@JoJo9942 has right, we have just 3 Civs in this theme: - Huns - Magyars - Cumans ---
**Author:** ![Lonezwiebel](https://forums.ageofempires.com/user_avatar/forums.ageofempires.com/lonezwiebel/32/29843_2.png) [@Lonezwiebel](https://forums.ageofempires.com/u/Lonezwiebel)\ **Post date:** [May 25, 2020, 7:30am UTC](https://forums.ageofempires.com/t/balance-sugestions-for-may-patch/81845/213 "2020-05-25T07:30:46Z")
Yes I know and that is a big nerf for Indians. For me Indians have big lack of alternatives. What if the enemy does not play with cavalry Units? So you will struggle a lot. Lithuanians are quite strong now because eof the big buff. It’s stupid to talk about win rate. And 10G+ is not a big nerf. It’s just fair to other civs and to Knights units that are quite more expensive. [Previous page](https://forums.ageofempires.com/t/balance-sugestions-for-may-patch/81845.md?page=9) [Next page](https://forums.ageofempires.com/t/balance-sugestions-for-may-patch/81845.md?page=11)