Byzantines - Balance Poll

Especialy TC - this will help civ in Dark Age, because it will be possible to heal scout.

Cavalry is almost as big as the TC tho

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Yeah,a lot of player don’t realise that elite cataphract even lose FU cavalier without logistica, man, they cost 10 more food for each and spend thousands of resources and stone , can’t even beat cavalier, BTW also weaker than knight in castle age,at least huskarl can beat longswords man at equal number with more move speed and also destroy archers .what’s more? Cataphract actually move slower than knight line, and less PA . without elite upgrade, Their attack have same speed to knight 1.8, so do less damage to any units who are not infantries.
That’s all stat show how suck they are compared with other units.
And some noob will said ,they can beat camel and halbs. Bro ,if u can buid up a cataphracts army for countering camels and pikes,I can tell u a secret ,that this game would be end much earlier if u put these resources on arbalesters or even hand cannoneers

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but unlike the knight and cavalier, they don’t get completely wrecked by pikes and camels.

false. they move at same speed.

and their elite upgrade is the fastest attacking cavalry unit in the game.

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Elite Huskarls lose against Persian Longswords with Blast Furnace and Platemail Armour.

Elite Huskarls are the only Infantry unit to lose cost-efficiency to Hussars.

Huskarls are like Cataphracts a lot. Cataphracts are only good against counter units, and Huskarls are only good against Archers and Buildings.

Cataphracts in high numbers are good against anything that doesn’t shoot arrows.

seriously. i’d put up 40 Elite Cataphracts with Logistica against 40 Teutonic Paladins.

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Without husbantry, yes, same spead 1.35, in the old tech tree mod on VB, their ove speed with husbantry is 1.43,and paladin is 1.49.

that seems like a problem with husbandry and it being applied then.
both have the same base movement speed of 1.35.
therefore after husbandry they should both have 1.49.

are you sure this is still true in DE?

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yes ,u just keeping saying that again and again ,likes u had been defeated by pikes and camels so may times when u crazy mass knight to fight forward to them. in the cas age ,speed units should kill more vils right?but cata will dead so easiler than knight by any TC fire or cas fire,with more expensive cost and a castle to produse.

so should cataphracts have no counters then? because frankly that seems screwed up to me.
every unit in the game must have a weakness.

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Yes high number man, so in the game, u opponent just wait u to mass cataphract? BTW 40 elite

cataphract can’t beat any paladins, may be u should learn this guy to test 100 vs 100 instead

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I am not sure about this but we all agree cataphract can’t ride opponent economic like knight do

Paladin civs like Franks or Huns have huge trouble against civs with great Camels, like Berbers, Indians and Malians.
Going for Mass Cav is also a huge missplay against Aztecs, Japanese and Goths.

Byzantines are the only civ that has Heavy Cavalry taht does not care about counter-Cavalry units.
You can always go against Goths or Malians with Cataphracts, because their efficient Halbs and Heavy Camels do not actually properly counter Cataphracts.

That is something that Franks, Persians, Teutons and Cumans cannot do, for example.

Cataphract no counter? I think they have too many counter, they loss so many units in equal resources, paladin ,halbs ,any range units ,even skirmishers can do 2 damage to them. Don’t talk about 50 vs 50 paladins or even more unrealistic fight

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most units lose in equal resources to paladin.

in low numbers maybe, but people have done tests where Cataphracts wreck Halbs something like 40 vs 100.

which means they get off 1 or maybe 2 shots and then get shredded from their.

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??? You are in dream? First of all goth only don’t have platemail armour, second , elite huskarls without last armor upgrade still beat persian longswords, last not least they move faster and eat archers and can ride economic and don’t even dead by tc fire

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Also means hussar only take you 1damage and also shredded them by much less resources

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Yes,but before u put equal resources to fight paladin ,u base or u vils were disappeared already

I’m not saying cataphracts don’t need some slight love, but you’re making it sound like one of the worst units ever made


Hera says what holds it back is its investment cost, which many are a fan of reducing.

Viper says the unit is A tier and “Very few units that actually kill them” and “the main thing that goes against them is their so expensive”, but once you get their, “he can’t think of too many units he would like to have against it”

which we have already covered.

true, but why are you making cataphracts if they are making trash units anyway?
if they are at the point where they are making trash you already won if you hve the resources for cataphracts.

if you have the resources to tech into Elite Cataphract and Logistica to fight against Paladins, you’ve already won the game.

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when u have 40 fully upgraded cataphract, and still have your base , that’s mean the game should be over 20min ago if u go arbalesters and siege.
And also maybe one big fight ,u elite cataphract army kill all halbs but how many times can u fight like this, halbs can be build up in min and fight u again, unless u got all gold in the map

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