Cistern exploit, revert 50 stone start!

You can build cistern with like ~5 villagers at enemy base instantly.
Since the last patch, Byzantines get 50 starting stone.
They can INSTANTLY build a cistern at your base and tower rush.

They then start to build a tower.
When you pull your own villagers to contetst, they can use Akritoi defenses and COMPLETELY SLAUGHTER your villagers.

I beg you players, PLEASE EXPLOIT this rush hard.
The more people exploit it, the more pressure will there be on Relic to hotfix this.

With that strat even a silver player can take out a conq, so please exploit it!

They could build a cistern in previous patch as well, its only 50 stone for that.

And no a silver player can’t take out conqueror this way.

Id argue even a platinum player couldn’t win against diamond this way.

The more people exploit it, the more we will figure out the counter. They just deny 1 gold and you can go to another gold or build your own tower first.

They have to cross the whole map gathering nothing

1 Like

Okay my bad, they could already build that cistern before.
I thought they had 0 starting stone before, now 50, my bad.

This active HAS TO be changed.
I’m in diamond league right now and was 20 points off conqueror in 1v1 a few days ago.
So this shit and jeanne darc keep happening to me and I’m starting to lose it.

Relic has to freaking fix this game for once.
Pump 16 civs into it and not balance them?
Come one, we PAID for it.
Fix it!

I’m Malian main right now by the way, so tell me what you can do when he tower+cistern rushes your front mine after you built your pitmine and houses and spent tons of wood.
It’s just game over.

I dont think bizantine is a problem. They are quite weak and the cistern thing is easy to counter with your own tower.

JD will need a nerf in next patch.

We don’t need Byzantines nerfed again, lol.

1 Like

Byzantine players are forced to tr with a must, and your scout still miss to find where the cistern is, lol.
Just build a tower in your gold when finding enemy workers moving to your base, problem solved.

Even at the time when mongo can move their base to enemy base to shoot enemy villagers, the problem is still capable to deal with by tower and wood wall. Now there’s still chinese age2 landmark rush, and dehli age3 keep rush. You can’t just keep blind to this and say it’s op.

2 Likes

I’m not even convinced the cistern rush strategy is stronger than Mongol tower rush or English villager rush.

It is.
When you get rushed by that bullshit and don’t see it coming with Malians until he places the cistern at your pitmine, you are just toast.
Game over.

They should either

  1. disable that ability until feudal age
  2. disable the ability it from being casted near the enemy capital towncenter
  3. disable the cistern from being built close to the enemy capital tc

Against Mongols you got a change at least.

Don’t start saying “but the Byzantines are such weak civ, they have to cheese to win”
NO! This is a bad excuse.
In the hands of a very good player, they can win fairly.
Also, they are just designed in an overcomplicated way, so the civ design is a big fail.
Devs should consider reworking them if (actually?!?) 99.9% of people find them too hard to play and hence the civ has a super bad win ratio throught all elo brackets in 1v1.

1 Like

Hot take: stop demanding sweeping balance changes catered specifically to your ranked experience. This isn’t the only such thread.

Changes will already come (and some have already), in the meantime, you need to work on your own play. As do most folks (I’m terrible, for example).

Who knows, down the line you could even be proven right about some predictions. But you weren’t right about the stone “exploit”, and kneejerk changes will harm balance more than they can help it.

3 Likes

Cistern rush with 5 vil is akin to eng 5 vil shortbow rush. They never removed that fromthe game??? Why should they remove this?

Also the counter is to get go to your 2nd gold. 5 vils walking 60s ## # #### ton of idle time.

The more they build at that location the more committed they are to said location.

1 Like

Good scouting can spot out this high risk strategy and what will they do if you spot it and take out their cistern before it goes up? even if their cistern goes up don’t engage.

You lose once to it and next game build a tower near your gold before they get there, adapt and overcome.

English vill rush is actually better because you are not tied to deny only 1 gold where the cistern is. If your opponent go to another gold you can just follow them.

1 Like

Instead, Byzantines need some buffs. Some of my ideas for the buffs I got are reducing the food cost of the Limitanei from 80 to 70 and adding a technology to the Palatine School and that technology can increase the chance of units spawning from that Landmark from 30% to 40%.

1 Like

That landmark is useless. Its a low RNG spawn that predicated on consistent production AND having sufficient population space??? If I’m at max pop and the last limitanei i produced to become pop cap JUST SO HAPPENS to be the unit that grants me a free unit feom the landmark; does the free unit at least gets queued? Or is that a loss opportunity??

Plus our real issues are on feudal/base playstyle/perks

1 Like

Got lamed once again by a cistern rush.
Checked his profie.
The player has only been playing cistern rush for the last tens of matches.

isn’t this topic dead? Specifically Cistern Rush is and was a thing even before the 50 stone increase? so reverting the 50 stone will NOT prevent cistern rush.

EXPLOIT, maybe a stretch; if cistern rush is an EXPLOIT; then English DEFENSIVE villager archers is an EXPLOIT when used to rush enemy gold.

Cistern “rush” is hardly worth anyones attention. Cisterns themselves are severely underwhelming (they do not yield the stated gather rate). The increasing cost makes it redundant to try any form of level 5 rush–you literally might as well lock it behind age ups or make each available after a set time.

They should make the price a set 100 - 125 so it can be used to expand rather whatever we got. As Byzantines, it seems silly that I feel like I’m always in stone debt or that I’m behind on stone.

The trickle of stone from building is simply insufficient to do much of anything.

1 Like

You’re wrong. The list gathering rate increase do in fact increase your active gathering as described.

Now whether they are worth it or not is another thing?

I think they are worth and very good. I would like if they capped the max cost to 200 stone.

1 Like