Civilization Idea: Bedouins

Age of Empires II: DE II - Discussion
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This is a “Camel+Siege” civ I designed on 29 January, 2020.

Camel & Siege Civilization

Team Bonus : Camel +2 LOS

Civilization Bonus :
- TC techs are 50% cheaper
- Siege Engineering free ( Requires University )
- Camels fire 25% faster

Unique Tech :
1. Rams +100 attack vs building (300 food, 400 wood)
2. Camels +4 attack vs Infantry (500 food, 450 gold) - UU included

Unique Unit : Camel (65 food, 65 gold)
HP : 105, 130
Attack : 6, 8
+2, +3 vs infantry
+1, +2 vs spearman
Melee Armor : 1, 2
Pierce Armor : 0
Firing Rate : 2.03
Speed : 1.4
LOS : 5
Elite Upgrade : 750 food, 600 gold

Tech Tree :
Barracks : No Halberdier
Archery Range : No HCA and Parthian Tactics
Stable : No Cavalier ( Have Steppe Lancer )
Siege Workshop : No SR
Blacksmith : No last armor for infantry and archer
Eco : No last farm and stone upgrade, guild
University : No BT, Treademill Crane, Arrowslit, Architecture, Heated Shot, Keep
Dock : No Heavy Demo, Fast Fire Ship, Shipwright
Monastery : No Theocracy, Heresy, Illumination, Block Printing
Castle : No Hoardings

Not the best suited for Bedouins. And personally I wish they wouldn’t have any siege bonus. As you and @Doeswegotta asking for some heavy cavalry+heavy infantry civ, I think I will also go that route with small camel bonus.

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This one gives the same amount of power through the ages, but the value of 2 goats is different age 1 than it would be in age 3. Also, a farm transition is a bit tough with a cap of 8 mills total.

See, heres the thing - the Bedouins were far from the nerds of the Saracens. They were closer to the Native Americans of the new world, but in the desert. The never did much with siege weapons because wood and even rope was just that scarce in the land - and you cant built a torsion siege device (onager, ballista) out of adobe.

Realistically, the Bedouins can only get away with having the siege ram and siege tower but that would be a stretch - they never really bothered themselves with siege battles, see?

Given all that, conisder;

Siege weapons deal +20/+25% bonus damage in Castle/Imperial Ages → Siege weapons and transport ships have a garrison space of 20.

Given that garrisons in siege weapons scale up the speed (and attack for rams) that might be useful enough for for a civ that technically shouldn’t have a siege workshop to begin with.

Also, I tend to balance my suggestions around the concept of a civ with a weaker castle/imp and especially post imp so I’m going for bonuses that would make for smoother early pressure. To be clear are we on the same page with that, or are you designing a more late game focused civ?

Its like how the transportation industry is vital to trade without the actual sailors or truckers being involved in the transactions.

The Bedouins never had enough scale to produce things to sell off as surplus - the did have the ability to cross the desert they lived in, which they got hired to to by their neighbors. That income was typically used to buy armor and weapons from the romans/persians and livestock from the africans.

So yea, they bedouins got their own sustenance from herding/fishing but enabling trade was pretty their only industry for economic growth as a society.

Creativity be hard yo. I want to give them something for having such a historically weighty military unit, but translating it into aoe2 game mechanics without breaking the game is tough.

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Not true. Bedouins under the command of Salih ibn Mirdas besieged Aleppo, which is where that bonus comes from.

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And how did they win that siege? Did they invent a new siege engine that changed the course of local warfare tradition?

Or did they have a more typical siege battle - ladders and archers vying for control of fortifications?

I had in my head when I said siege things like trebs, mangs and cannons blasting away at castle walls - in the period of aoe2, beginning to end, its hard to give the bedouins too much relevance there.

Afaik, they’re main claims to fame were swordsmanship, mobility and eventually numbers.

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Dude! No need to add Bedouins because those are already represented by the Saracens considering the fact that Bedouins are a group of Arabs. And no, the Saracens will NOT be split because splitting more civs will cause way too many more civs to be added. Not to mention, balance would be a bigger issue.

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A Kurdish civ concept would definitely be better.

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The Saracens are a mashup of the Mesopotamians, Egyptians and whatever crusader fanfics were popular in France 500 years ago.

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I know. Designing my own fantasy civs for 5 years now and I’m also stuck unless I use new gimmick mechanics like charge attacks, armor ignoring attacks, aura effect, 1 time usage bonus etc.

How good were their Cav Archer? I’m personally inclined to a CA+Camel civ or CA+Infantry civ. I know Saracens have one of the best Camel and FU CA. Another arab civ with Camel+CA will be similar. But saracens usually can’t afford 2 gold units unless one of the gold unit is monk. Meanwhile I’m inclined to a Camel+CA civ that can actually afford such double gold army composition.

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Game already have persians byzantines berbers to represent the none arabic peoples.

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Well, the cav archers of the boudins were at first, non existent. They had camel archers which never shot while mounted - they would sit the camel down, get off, and fire while crouching behind the mount like it was a living bunker.

They later adopted horse archers with their own spin on things - less range and power in the bows with a higher fire rate, and faster horses with even less than normal armor.

Unfortunately, these horse archers seemed pretty ineffective - the weaker/faster bows left them with unable to deal with mail for the most part and the lower range + less armor meant they were fodder for enemy archers with longer range.

Depending on how much historical accuracy you want, the best camel + ca civ should prolly be drawn from central asia. The mogols were used to using bactrian camels in the gobi desert, which are shorter but stronger than dromedary (arab) camels - these are a big part of how the mongols (and other trukic tribes) could thrive in their native territory.

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And Turks too.

(20 characters)

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Gargy, if you’re going to be a ban evader and try to get away with it, I suggest that you not only not DM me with no prior interactions, but also that you don’t behave the way you always do.

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No, because you’re probably going to be gone within the next hour.

@FloosWorld, we got another one.

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Well, that’s just uncalled for.

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And here I thought, them being nomadic will be as good horse archer as steppe people. Anyway here is an “Infantry” civ with some bonuses for mounted units (cavalry+camel). I tried my best to be unique and different enough from Saracens. Since Saracens have bonuses on everything but infantry, cavalry and eco, I’ll focus on those 3.

Team Bonus - Infantry +3 attack bonus vs siege

Civ Bonus -
Can build Pasture that replaces Farms. [Pasture (Size - 2x2, Cost - 150 wood, Time - 40 seconds, rest are same as Mill) [Pasture can be used as a drop off building for Shepherd only. It can also train sheep for 10/8/6/4 in Dark/Feudal/Castle/Imperial Age food in 40 seconds.]
Barracks spawn 1 Militia line unit after construction.
Squires and Husbandry available in Feudal Age and cost -50%.
Scout Cavalry +1/+2 attack in castle/Imperial age.

Unique Techs

  1. Militia line cost -50%. (650 food, 250 gold, 45 seconds)
  2. Camel units deal 25% trample damage within 0.5 tile. (800 food, 600 gold, 60 seconds)

Unique Unit
Ghazi- A multipurpose camel unit.
Cost - 50 food, 50 gold
Training Time - 18 seconds
HP - 100, 125
Armor - 1/1
Attack - 8, 11
Attack Bonus - +4, +8 vs cavalry, +3, +5 vs Camel
ROF - 1.9
Speed - 1.45

Technology Tree
Missing things:
Buildings - Stone wall, Farm
Barracks - Supplies+Gambeson, Champion, Eagle
Archery Range - Arbalester, TR, HC, PT
Stable - Paladin, SL, BE
Siege Workshop - SR, SO, BBC
Blacksmith - Plate Barding Armor
Monastery - Atonement, Heresy, Illumination, Theocracy
Dock - Galleon, Dry Dock, Elite CG, Dromon
University - Architecture, Fortified Wall (No stone wall anyway), Keep, BBT, Arrowslits
Castle - Hoardings
Eco - Two Man Saw