Delhi could use some love [PUP]

Age of Empires IV IV - Discussion
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Delhi received a nerf last patch with Herbal Medicine healing being reduced from +100%->60% and Tower Elephants receiving a large health nerf without the cost being adjusted - increased ranged armor, but were not usually dying to range units.

Now on the PUP all civs received an eco upgrade cost reduction by 30%, but Delhi did not see a reduction in their research time. This is a huge slap in the face to this already suffering civ.

More so Elephants are in a weird place. War Elephants are destroyed by cheap spearmen, and crossbow, and Tower Elephants are a mediocre back line unit now that they cannot damage soak. Instead of playing with their stats, lets finally make them unique.

Abbasid Camels are a great example, you basically will see camels in any composition because of their aura buffs, and I think we should do the same with Delhi Elephants. We should add an aura that slows movement or attack speed, reduces nearby enemy armor, etc. They could really make a viable support unit without breaking the game.

Delhi is in an okay place on the live servers. But with the way things are looking in the next patch, they will hardly be a viable civ, completely extinct from tournaments, and decimated in the lower ranks. Please show them some love.

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how i analyze delih if the professionals just don’t garrison the scholars instead they lead them into battle

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What I miss from elephants is some speed boost like Delhi infantry has. That would allow elephants to engage bettter or retreat.

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An AOE3 concept!! You know what? As much as I shit on AOE3 and others in the aoe4 community a lot has been grafted into this game from aoe3 to include almost the whole ottoman design. I wouldn’t mind if War Elephants ONLY had an aura that slowed units down near them.

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I’ve been saying literally that exactly, since last year.

Even prospectively having it start at a marginal amount of a buff, increasing with additional elephants, up to a certain, reasonable limit.

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Just to be clear y’all happy paying 1000 Res for a support unit? You’re going to pay 1000 Res just so the enemy is 5% slower , and your whole army is of course also slower to keep pace with the ele?

Make them actually terrifying instead of a giant target, give them something like forced march except they can still attack, or some version of a activated charge/trample

Anyone that has played total war knows what an elephant should do :rofl:

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Perhaps the Delhi Sultanate can be given a new unique unit as the War Elephant will be a regional unit in the future to be used for other civilizations that used elephants in battles (I.e., Chola Dynasty and Persians). The new unique unit the Delhi Sultanate can get is the Ghulam.

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Idk where you’re getting 5% from, but something is better than what we currently have.

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Elephants should be the most terrifying thing on the battlefield, at least to a foot soldier or anything that is smaller than the said murder beast. In AOE 4 they are fat donkeys with 2 archers on top. With Delhi, someone got the bright idea of free tech and that’s it, now no one can think past that one point. Which is useless to Delhi by late game as everyone techs up and they decreased cost of all techs. So just keep getting direct and indirect nerfs because apparently Delhi going wild with the wins.

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This is dont true. Delhi need buff.

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Agree. Im not a great player, but for me - Delhi is the most hard civ to win. They are fine in start of feodal, but castle (with nerfed elehpants) and imperial (with extremely long time of upgrades) - they just dont have any tools for win.

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For me the saddest thing was that there was zero compensation for buffing eco techs for everyone else.

Like it would’ve made sense if Delhi had been top tier, and therefore didn’t need compensation, but they decided to buff every single other civ, without compensating the bottom civ that also doesn’t benefit from the game wide buff.

It doesn’t take an expert to realise there was something wrong with that.

They aren’t an auto lose civ, but coupled with Otto’s hard counterring Delhi’s best thing in castle age(Jan v ele) I really hope Devs pull out a buff before this PUP is implemented in game

I also think the relic nerf hurts Delhi more than anyone else, due to their poor eco, making the reduced income felt even more (as opposed to something like the monster ecos on HRE and rus missing out on little)

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Support it! Bring elephants back into the game (really), they got no viability in Imperial.

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When you play Delhi, just assume you don’t have any unique units. It would make things easier!

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Im all down for Delhi changes but focusing that hard on eles is a bit awks. I get that theyre a fun meme in other games but they lost almost every major battle they featured in: white huns, alexander, ummayads, turks, timurids, etc. Historical accuracy isnt needed, but reletively more relevance was a selling point and I bought that.

Small buffs are nice for gameplay - lower cost and more speed on tower eles, more sege damage on war eles and the like - but id rather the landmarks and civ perks get the bigger changes and then we see if theres any direct needs for units/eco after.

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this means absolutely nothing. stop pushing your own agenda, and try to imagine whats good for the game

people love big stompy units, tons of people want /wanted /assumed elephants would be good, and almost none of them care about the historical accuracy of it.

this doesnt make the civ more interesting to play, it makes them a stronger generic civ. even when delhi was powerful and winning a high % of games (due to their over tuned eco, healing etc) it still wasnt that appealing except when elephants were viable

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Acabo de pasar la campaña de Age of Empires 2:Indian Dinasties.

Considerando que ya cubrieron a los Chola y a otras dinastias antes de que viniera el Sultanato de Delhi y el resto de sultanatos de la India, tengo la sospecha de que para agregar a los INDIOS como civ, van a elejir al imperio Vijayanagara (XIII- XVI), y tal vez al reino de Sri-Lanka

Intentando hacer mi propia especulación del imperio, surge el mismo problema que hubo en Age of Empires 2: Forgotten, Los Hindus carecían de elefantes porque los persas ya lo tenían de unidad unica. Veo que la solución que han ideado en el ultimo DLC es que el “Elefante Arquero” sea una unidad común para las civ de la india, y el Elefante de asedio reemplaza al ariete. Me parece bien.

Siendo eso asĂ­ en age2, en Age4: ÂżQue pasarĂ­a si intentan agregar a Vijayanagara y Sri-Lanka como civ, considerando que el elefante melee y el de arqueros son unidades Ăşnicas del Sultanato de Delhi? Pienso que igual que pasĂł con Mali y los Ottomanos con el Iman, los elefantes pasaran a a ser de uso compartido, unidad comĂşn, tanto para estos imperios como para posibles civ del sur de China (Indonesia, Mianmar, etc)

Siendo así cabe preguntarse ¿Se quedará solo el Schoolar como la unidad única “unica” del Sultanato de Delhi? Tengo la sospecha de que podrían estar considerando darle una unidad única extra, el Ghulam del Aoe2 posiblemente.

Sugerencias para Delhi:

  • 1.- Unidad Ăşnica adicional.- Darle una unidad Ăşnica más, si es posible en feudal (Ghulam por ejemplo). Van a tener que hacerlo si la civ quiere diferenciarse lo suficiente de Vijayanagara.
  • 2.- Habilidad Estampida de Elefantes.- Darle alguna habilidad a los elefantes, como “estampida” para que aceleren algunos segundos y sean peligrosos, pero obvio solo dura un tiempo y tiene cowldown, asi al menos llegan a la base enemiga a tiempo y siguen siendo una fuerza de peligro.
  • 3.- Más tecnologĂ­as.- Para que los elefantes se muevan más rápido, en el Aoe2 está el Mahouts, que los incrementa la velocidad 30%.
  • 4.- Menor costo.- Talvez eso los haga más viables.
  • 5.- Considerar que en un futuro algunas nuevas civs con elefantes, necesitaran que los usen si quieren sentir que tienen utilidad. Si no, Delhi no será la unica civ donde la gente no jugara elefantes en imperial, al menos en ranked 1vs1.
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IN ENGLISH:
I just finished the Age of Empires 2: Indian Dynasties campaign.

Considering that they already covered the Chola and other dynasties before the Delhi Sultanate (Wich is either represented by Hindustanis) and the rest of the sultanates of India came, I have the suspicion that to add the INDIANS as a new civ. they are going to choose the Vijayanagara empire (XIII- XVI ), and perhaps the kingdom of Sri-Lanka.

Trying to make my own speculation of this civ (Vijayanagara) come the same problem that happened in Age of Empires 2: Forgotten, "the Hindus lacked elephants because the Persians already had them as their unique unit. I see that the solution they have come up with in the latest DLC is that the “Elephant Archer” had became a common unit for Indian civs, and the Siege Elephant replaces the battering ram. That seems fine to me.

What if they try to add Vijayanagara and Sri-Lanka as civ in Aoe4, considering melee elephant and archer elephant are unique units of Delhi Sultanate? I think that just as it happened with Mali and the Ottomans with the Imam, the elephants will become shared, a common unit, both for these empires and for possible civ from southern China (Indonesia, Myanmar, etc.)

This being the case, it is worth asking: Will the Schoolar remain alone as the only “unique” unit of the Delhi Sultanate? I have a sneaking suspicion they might be considering giving him an extra unique unit, the Aoe2 Ghulam possibly.

Suggestions for Delhi:

1.- Additional unique unit.- Give it one more unique unit, (Ghulam for example). They’re going to have to if the civ wants to differentiate itself sufficiently from the Vijayanagara.
2.- Elephant Stampede Ability.- Give some ability to the elephants, such as “stampede” so that they accelerate for a few seconds and are dangerous, but obviously it only lasts for a while and has cowldown, so at least they reach the enemy base on time and they remain a dangerous force. They make a unique tech in Aoe2 to persians to “speed up” the elephants
3.- Unique Tech.- To speed up the slowness of elephants, as Mahouts of Aoe2. It can even be “expert Mahouts”, or whatever but improve them.
4.- Lower cost.- To make them more profitable… seriously, a paladin costs much less, and that there are civs that can produce them in feudal.
5.- Consider that in a future those new civs with elefants need to use Elephant, this units need to be more powerful or at least a threat, or if not, Delhi would not be the unique civ. whose player dont use the elephant units… at least in ranked 1vs1.

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I don’t think active ability on elephants is a good idea. War elephants should instead have a charge ability similar to that of fire lancers that does area damage on initial impact. As for tower elephants, I think it’s time they are given a cost reduction at the very least!
But I wish Delhi’s problem was only limited to the elephants. Their imperial tech time is still insane!

That said Delhi is a very hard civ to balance! They are already considered a strong civ among high-tier players for 1v1s on open land maps. They are still subpar in team matches.

1 Like