Do you think the bonus of berry gathering is boring design? (Muslim; Abbasid; Delhi)

We know that Muslims cannot eat pork, so Islamic civilizations cannot hunt wild boars. However, they just give a bonus to Islamic civilizations to gather berry faster. Do you think this design is boring?

The berry gathering rate: 0.66 f/s
The deer gathering rate: 0.825 f/s
The berry gathering rate of Abbasid: 0.66*0.25 = 0.825 f/s

Watch these official videos.
Age of Empires IV: The Mongols
Age of Empires IV: Abbasid Dynasty vs Mongols

The Mongol in history were both nomads and conquerors, so they had more offense than defense. They used their great mobility to create the Mongol Empire. That’s why the Mongol in AoE4 cannot build the wall or other defensive building but outpost. However, their outpost cost is cheaper with an speed aura, Yam, which was a postal system or point route messenger system extensively used and expanded by Ögedei Khan and also used by subsequent Khans. Besides, they don’t need to collect the stone to build the defensive buildings, but they can build the Ovoo to gather the stone to produce more units or upgrade the improved techs. These designs are more interesting than the berry gathering bonus.

The meat except seafood is forbidden in Japan for a period of time. That’s why the Japanese in AoE3 cannot hunt any animals including the livestock animals, but they can build the shrine attracting animals and generating resources.

The cow in Hindu society is traditionally identified as a caretaker and a maternal figure, and Hindu society honors the cow as a symbol of unselfish giving, selfless sacrifice, gentleness and tolerance. That’s why the Indians in AoE3 cannot gather the food from the livestock animals, but they can build the Sacred Field which livestock can be stationed to generate XP.

There are 2 Islamic civilizations in AoE4. Did Relic just design the same bonus for two different civilizations? (Delhi and Abbasid) It’s very boring.


Idk to me with 8 civ it’s super hard to make heavy asymetry and good balance. They should have make or 4-5 civ very asymetric, or a sort of AoM like (mostly what they did) making 2 civ close to each other but very different from others (that’s why 4 euro civ is to much, england, france and HRE shared the same technology and same units in this time period, and rus are not that far tbh, it’s hard to make asymetry in this situation)

I’m glad they’re representing Islam correctly, but I think the whole berry thing is just balancing. It’s kinda boring, but I personally can’t think of a thing that would make sense for it tbh. The Delhi and Abbasids weren’t known for their farming. Or their foraging. Or their fishing. Or their hunting.


Do all maps have boars?

Didn’t pay attention to what had boars or not, no clue.

I think the berry bonus matches the Delhi Sultanate more than the Abbasids because it matches a more hindu-influenced pseudo vegetarian life style.

I think it would make more sense for the Abbasids to have some kind of bonus regarding herdables instead - goat/lamb being very popular in the Syrian / Persian / Arabian area that the Abbasids controlled. Plus I don’t know how much berries you could really harvest in the desert.


I don’t like how they destroyed the boar as a food source in general, but having some civs that absolutely cannot use it should be explained better ingame. First time I tried hunting it and allah intervened I thought it was a bug : P
It will also be an awkward situation once other animals are introduced which could replace the boar for certain map biomes (like the elephants and rhinos on AOE2’s africa maps).

It’s also odd to make the boar such a specific resource node (fat lumb of food which you have to send an army for to gather) and then exclude a few civs from it. In an environment where animals are more similar in behaviour and food content (AOE1/2/3) this would feel more natural. AOE3 had a nice angle on it by giving such civs a different use for those animals (japanese and indians).

Having the berry collection rate be the same as the animal gather rate? It can be tweaked on the way if it is badly balanced, but it is certainly not interesting or something I would connect the civs with.
It would’ve been more exciting to get an alternative or long-term use out of the berry bushes, a bit like the english get gold from farms or the mongols built their ovoos on stone deposits. Cultivating them as orchards so they regrow or sth. (a direction which the fences around them already indicate).

I have no problem with that, the bonus is simply to compensate for them not having access to boars and it only affect their early game most of the time which is rather similar for most civs anyways. And the way they set up their economies differ a lot as the game progress into the mid and late game so you can’t say there is no variety in there

And it lead to 10+ years of constant complain and to japan being one of the most hated civs in the game. I would rather a thousand times having a “boring” Berry gathering bonus than having to deal with houses that generate ressources again.

1 Like

So does that mean that DS cannot hunt boars? That would be a historical inaccuracy because DS ruled over a wide variety of cultures, hunting boars is common in rural/tribal areas

Hindus do eat meat. Even eating Beef is common in the southern and northeastern states.
India is like Europe each region will have different customs and traditions, putting it all under one umbrella feels wrong.


As with today, relatively isolated tribes and rural areas tend not to be policed as much.
If a modern ruling class isn’t able to enforce rules nowadays I could only imaging how much you could get away with in medieval times.

what is preventing you from hunting deers? btw hunting deers is also same as berry now since, the meat don’t decay, you slap em deers with scouts then gather them, just the 3D model is different.

Do you mean in general or for the Abbasids?

In general deer have much faster food collection rates than herdables and berries.
Berries have always kinda been the worst food source.