[Feedback] Demeter feels incredibly underpowered in 1v1 (1600+ Elo perspective)

[_MarakuJa]

After testing the Demeter God Pack since yesterday, I feel like she is currently the weakest Greek Major God by a significant margin. Her current win rate (around 25% for players above 1600 Elo) I understand that people are still learning how to play her, but the Greek playstyle remains the same. Someone told me in a match that she was just a worse version of Hades — I’m starting to believe that, even though I actually enjoyed playing her quite a lot. (Im trying hard to learn.)

But… here is a breakdown of why she feels so “clunky” compared to Zeus, Hades, or Poseidon:

The “Fortress Unit” Problem Every other Greek god has a powerhouse human unit in the Fortress (Myrmidons, Hetairoi, Gastrafetes). Demeter has… nothing but the Harpy. The Harpy has only 200 HP and its only utility is picking up a unit for some seconds. It doesn’t hold a frontline, it doesn’t siege, and it doesn’t scale. It’s bizarre that she lacks a dedicated elite human unit like the rest of the pantheon.

Persephone’s “All-in” is not a game-ender Underworld Invasion sounds broken on paper, but in practice, the resurrected units have significantly reduced HP. Since you sacrifice all your Town Centers (TCs) to use it, if you don’t win in that exact moment, you’ve deleted your own economy for a “half-dead” army that can’t finish the job. Compared to the Japanese release power-creep, this feels very tame. (Maybe they could get stronger as you sacrifice more Town Centers?)

Minor God issues (Pan & Hestia)

Lykaon (Pan): The attack is decent, but at Speed 3, it’s a joke. It can’t chase anything, and at high Elo, players just micro away. It also dies fast to heroes.

Hestia’s Power: The conversion radius is tiny and the cast time is slow. Any competent player just moves their units out of the circle. It’s too easy to counter.

Hamadryad (Hestia): The upgrade to make it viable (attacking villagers) costs 300 Food and 25 Favor. In a 1v1 on a small map, that is way too expensive for a unit that is easily spotted moving around. It might work in Team Games, but in 1v1, it’s a wasted investment.

Conclusion Currently, when I queue as Demeter, my opponents literally ask me if I’ve managed to win a single game with her yet. She feels like a “support” god forced into a 1v1 environment without the necessary tools to compete with the Greek “Big Three.”

someone experiencing the same? Does she need a dedicated human unit in the Fortress or a massive buff to the Lykaon’s speed and Harpy’s HP to be viable? I would like the dedicated human unit please

[Urban_Hunter]

I agree with the local Lycanthrope. At that speed, he’s simply an economically and population ineffective vill. Apparently, the idea was that you’d use population growth as your primary source of victory. You’ll either have more vills thanks to the Lycanthrope, or a larger attacking army. Playing defensively requires gathering mass before attacking.

Units’ special abilities should not be hidden behind upgrades.

I have no complaints about the Harpy as a unique unit, other than that it’s useless. It’s very expensive and very weak as a warrior. All it can do is kill some powerful mythical unit like a Mummy, and the rest of the time it sits behind the army (when they finally fix the speed of flying units in formations so Caladrians/Harpies don’t fly away from the army). Overall, it’s useless in the late game. Its only use is at the beginning of the Heroic Age. Bad design.

On the other hand, the Harpy perfectly reflects my preferences for flying units. I’d give all flying units less HP and more speed.

I suggest give her an attack animation where she dives at enemies in an ellipse and then returns to her original position, so that she distracts units and ACTUALLY CREATE MESS IN THE BATTLE.

---

We have a god of hoplites and heroes, a god of cavalry, and a god of archers. They could have made a god of buildings and mythical units. That’s all that’s left.

[Cajocu01]

Been reading this a lot.
It does seem to feel like her tempo game is too slow to pay off compared to other current things.

Thats said, her lack of win con on 2 clicks ability is prob was tanking her winrate compared to other DLC releases

@_MarakuJa

The attack is decent, but at Speed 3, it’s a joke. It can’t chase anything, and at high Elo, players just micro away. It also dies fast to heroes.

Yea it feeels quite expensive, the transofrmation is long enough you can kill it before it gets there

Also the heroic age hero feels quite anoying with all it has going on for him, what do you think of him?

[Moonshadow7475]

The mini ceasefire has potential for a lot of cheeses so i wouldn’t count her winrate yet.

[Hon3y]

The harpy is very disappointing for a fortress unit compared to the other Civs who make these units as their main army vs a unit you can only build very few of due to favor cost and seems more suited used to harass villagers in the mythic age. Many other things can be fixed but not sure they would replace a unit so this is one of my least favorite pieces of the new content.

[_MarakuJa]

@Hon3y

not sure they would replace a unit so this is one of my least favorite pieces of the new content.

Maybe if everyone who bought and enjoyed playing her asked for a new unit… But that probably won’t happen, since not everyone bought her, and only those who were already playing Greeks before are actually going to use her… In other words, the devs will probably just ignore any suggestion or criticism about this, and we’ll end up with a fourth Greek god without a special human unit at the Fortress.

[_MarakuJa]

@Cajocu01

Also the heroic age hero feels quite anoying with all it has going on for him, what do you think of him?

He’s pretty weak in combat, dies easily. But he does have his advantages — he’s very good as a raiding unit. I still don’t really know what the hell he’s throwing, whether they’re grenades or not, but honestly it ended up looking pretty weird. He has strong advantages and equally strong disadvantages.

I honestly would have preferred a standard archer hero, but I’m not sure who would fit… (I looked it up on GPT here, and it mentioned Ajax’s half brother, Teucer, and he actually seems like a perfect fit.)

[_MarakuJa]

@Urban_Hunter

I agree with the local Lycanthrope. At that speed, he’s simply an economically and population ineffective vill. Apparently, the idea was that you’d use population growth as your primary source of victory. You’ll either have more vills thanks to the Lycanthrope, or a larger attacking army. Playing defensively requires gathering mass before attacking.

Units’ special abilities should not be hidden behind upgrades.

I have no complaints about the Harpy as a unique unit, other than that it’s useless. It’s very expensive and very weak as a warrior. All it can do is kill some powerful mythical unit like a Mummy, and the rest of the time it sits behind the army (when they finally fix the speed of flying units in formations so Caladrians/Harpies don’t fly away from the army). Overall, it’s useless in the late game. Its only use is at the beginning of the Heroic Age. Bad design.

On the other hand, the Harpy perfectly reflects my preferences for flying units. I’d give all flying units less HP and more speed.

I suggest give her an attack animation where she dives at enemies in an ellipse and then returns to her original position, so that she distracts units and ACTUALLY CREATE MESS IN THE BATTLE.

---

We have a god of hoplites and heroes, a god of cavalry, and a god of archers. They could have made a god of buildings and mythical units. That’s all that’s left.

I think I agree with everything you said.

[2gv]

Lycantrop in his wolf form should be at least as fast as a Minotaur, 3.5 speed is a joke.

His upgrade should be removed so you don’t have to waste 300 food in classical, his special ability must be available from the start, same for the Hamadryad.

Wolf villager should be able to garrison and heroes should have a malus against them because they are still considered myth units and almost one-shotted by heroes.

[Fyrapan90]

Feedback on Demeter Identity and Design Concerns

I want to give some honest feedback on Demeter, because this is the first time since Retold launched that I’ve felt genuinely disappointed with a content release.

Right now, Demeter feels underdeveloped and lacking a clear identity, especially compared to the other Greek major gods. When choosing a major god, there should be a strong reason to pick them. With Zeus, Poseidon, or Hades, you immediately understand their strengths and playstyle. With Demeter, that clarity just isn’t there.

Main concerns:

1. Lack of a strong military identity

Her military bonuses feel situational and not impactful enough to define a playstyle. The units and myth units don’t feel like they synergize into a clear strategy. Instead of feeling unique, it feels scattered. As a result, it’s hard to justify picking her in competitive or even casual matches when other gods offer stronger and clearer advantages.

2. Heroes feel underwhelming

Another major issue is that Demeter’s heroes don’t feel impactful or exciting to use. Greek heroes are typically a defining part of the civ’s identity, especially in myth-heavy matchups. However, Demeter’s hero options feel either too standard or lacking meaningful bonuses that make them stand out.

They don’t offer a noticeable power spike, unique mechanic, or strategic advantage that changes how you approach myth unit engagements. Because of that, even in situations where heroes should shine, they feel average rather than defining. For a new major god, this feels like a missed opportunity to introduce something memorable.

3. Animations and presentation feel below expectations

Part of what makes Retold feel modern and high quality is its visual polish. Unfortunately, some of Demeter’s myth units and heroes don’t feel up to the animation standard we’ve come to expect from the game.

Certain attack animations and movement sequences feel stiff or unfinished, lacking the weight and personality seen in other units. For a new god pack, presentation matters just as much as balance. When animations feel underwhelming, it contributes to the overall impression that the content was rushed.

4. Economic bonuses don’t feel meaningful

Since Demeter is thematically tied to agriculture and growth, you would expect a strong and satisfying eco identity. However, her eco tools don’t feel game-defining or noticeably powerful compared to alternatives. They exist, but they don’t change how you approach the game.

5. No elite fortress unit

This is a big one for many of us. Greek major gods traditionally get something impactful tied to their Fortress. A lot of players were hoping for something like an Amazon elite unit or another unique late-game option. Instead, we didn’t receive anything that fills that role. That absence makes the god pack feel incomplete.

6. Overall design feels rushed

The kit feels like a collection of ideas rather than a fully realized concept. It doesn’t feel polished to the same level as previous Retold additions. That’s surprising, because up until now the developers have done an excellent job with the game overall.

The most disappointing part isn’t just balance, balance can be patched. The bigger issue is identity and fun factor. Even if numbers are adjusted, unless there is a deeper redesign or stronger defining feature, Demeter risks remaining a less interesting option compared to the rest of the Greek roster.

I’m sharing this because I care about the game. Retold has been handled very well so far, which is why this release stands out. I hope the team considers adjustments that give Demeter a clearer, more distinctive playstyle that makes players genuinely excited to pick her.

[Moonshadow7475]

@Fyrapan90

No elite fortress unit

I think this is actually the missing piece. Her identity crisis and lack of military coherence could be fixed by adding a backbone unit to the fortress.

[2gv]

I agree on the identity and presentation issues, when I read Demeter I was expecting a farmland, but unfortunately she ended up being the god that builds the least amount of farms.

Her farms has to be way different from a normal farm, at least twice larger, but the whole thing has been rushed, unfortunately.

It is not just a competitive issue, cosmetics are important aswell if not more than MP, you need cool things that attract casual and new players who buy the DLC.

[EricTheRed283]

@Fyrapan90

Lack of a strong military identity

Her military bonuses feel situational and not impactful enough to define a playstyle. The units and myth units don’t feel like they synergize into a clear strategy. Instead of feeling unique, it feels scattered. As a result, it’s hard to justify picking her in competitive or even casual matches when other gods offer stronger and clearer advantages.

Demeter is all about Archers and Infantry with support from her Heroes if you go Ares, Hestia and Persephone when it comes to military. Having Archers that do more damage with Fated Arrows ricocheting off enemies and Infantry in melee which boost your human units attack speed when they die with pious sacrifice is a cool combo. A lot of people based of what I see from https://aomstats.io/ are going Pan, Hestia and Persephone.

@Fyrapan90

Heroes feel underwhelming

Another major issue is that Demeter’s heroes don’t feel impactful or exciting to use. Greek heroes are typically a defining part of the civ’s identity, especially in myth-heavy matchups. However, Demeter’s hero options feel either too standard or lacking meaningful bonuses that make them stand out.

They don’t offer a noticeable power spike, unique mechanic, or strategic advantage that changes how you approach myth unit engagements. Because of that, even in situations where heroes should shine, they feel average rather than defining. For a new major god, this feels like a missed opportunity to introduce something memorable.

Orpheus has a unique ability of boosting nearby human units attack against myth units which is a great special ability and he has a ranged attack which is the only Age I Ranged Greek hero as seen below.

Icarus is a flying hero which is totally unique not just for the Greeks but for any civilization.

With that said Demeter’s Mythical Age Hero King Midas is underwhelming compared to the other Greeks Mythical Age heroes. Would of been cool that whenever he kills a human unit it gives you some gold into your coffers right away instead of just a chance to turn it into a gold that can be mined.

@Fyrapan90

Economic bonuses don’t feel meaningful

Since Demeter is thematically tied to agriculture and growth, you would expect a strong and satisfying eco identity. However, her eco tools don’t feel game-defining or noticeably powerful compared to alternatives. They exist, but they don’t change how you approach the game.

2 villagers can gather from each individual Farm which makes transitioning into farming the easiest in the game.

Buildings are built faster near Gold Mines is a nice little eco boost especially if you decide to build a Village Center/Town Center near one when you got Pan’s Pioneers that spawns Lykaon Villagers from them when built.

Getting livestock spawning on age up and livestock helping with Favor generation gives Demeter a favor generation advantage while also being able to go Aphrodite in Age III for Golden Apples to further boost favor generation. Demeter is great for her favor economy.

@Fyrapan90

No elite fortress unit

This is a big one for many of us. Greek major gods traditionally get something impactful tied to their Fortress. A lot of players were hoping for something like an Amazon elite unit or another unique late-game option. Instead, we didn’t receive anything that fills that role. That absence makes the god pack feel incomplete.

Demeter doesn’t have any unique Elite human unit that is totally different type (Infantry,Cavalry or Archer) but she does have Harpy a unique Myth unit instead. I personally wish she had a unique elite human unique but I can understand why they didn’t do that because it would be a infantry, cavalry or archer unit which has already been done.

[Urban_Hunter]

I absolutely did not like the fact that after receiving one heroic upgrade, the Toxots become competitive with Hades’ Taxots, who received upgrades in the Classic, Heroic, and Mythic ages.
Disgusting.

@EricTheRed283

Also, a 5x bonus against mythical units. Who came up with that? I mean, wasn’t it immediately obvious it was a bad idea even in the development stage?

[Cajocu01]

Hes stronger in combat as well than the other heroic archer heroes imo, since he has greater mobility in Flight and an aoe attack, which means he is quite good taking down backlines, specially counter archers that struggle to snipe him down more.

@_MarakuJa

equally strong disadvantages

Im interesting in what would this be for you?

I thou agree thou that with some of the other demeter short comings this strong hero doesnt seem to tilt the balance too much in her favor.

[Fyrapan90]

I understand your point, and I agree that Demeter has good synergies if you build around specific minor gods. Bountiful Farms, livestock on age-up, favor scaling at temples, Orpheus’ anti-myth aura, and Icarus being a flying hero are all real and interesting mechanics.

My issue isn’t that she lacks tools. It’s that her major god kit doesn’t clearly define a strategic direction on its own, the way the other Greek major gods do.

The archer/infantry combo you mentioned (Fated Arrows, Pious Sacrifice, etc.) comes from minor god tech choices, not from Demeter’s base design. That makes the identity conditional rather than inherent.

Her actual major god bonuses are mostly economic or structural: stronger farming, herdables, favor scaling, faster building near gold, Village Center scaling. Solid bonuses, but none of them directly shape army composition.

Harpies are useful and disruptive, but they’re more of a utility myth unit than something you build a composition around.

Orpheus’ anti-myth aura and Icarus’ mobility are valuable, but they don’t create a clear offensive power spike. King Midas especially leans economic rather than being a battlefield-defining Mythic Age hero compared to the others.

When you look at the rest of the Greek major gods, their direction feels clearer:

• Zeus leans into myth pressure and strong god power impact.

• Poseidon pushes cavalry tempo and map control.

• Hades reinforces ranged durability and defensive strength.

Demeter, by contrast, improves economic consistency and favor generation. That’s good, but it doesn’t clearly push you toward a specific military identity or tempo plan.

Even her eco strengths don’t fundamentally change how you approach macro. You still play standard Greek, you just transition to farms more smoothly and generate favor more comfortably.

Another important point is Fortress identity. Every other Greek major god has a defining unique human Fortress unit, Myrmidons, Hetairoi, Gastraphetes. Demeter doesn’t. She gets Harpies instead, which are a myth unit.

That matters because Fortress units traditionally anchor late-game compositions and reinforce a god’s theme. Without one, Demeter’s late game feels less distinct compared to the rest of the Greek roster.

I’m not saying she’s weak or unplayable. I just feel that, compared to Zeus, Poseidon, and Hades, her overall direction isn’t as clearly defined. Her bonuses are solid, but they don’t strongly answer the question: What is this god trying to push me toward?

And when that direction isn’t obvious from the major god itself, the design can feel less complete, even if the individual mechanics are good.

[_MarakuJa]

@EricTheRed283

With that said Demeter’s Mythical Age Hero King Midas is underwhelming compared to the other Greeks Mythical Age heroes. Would of been cool that whenever he kills a human unit it gives you some gold into your coffers right away instead of just a chance to turn it into a gold that can be mined.

It would be interesting if, every time he “tagged” a unit, and that unit died within a certain period of time, you received an amount of gold. Since he’s extremely weak, that’s why he’s useless — he can’t land the killing blow on any unit.

[_MarakuJa]

@Cajocu01

Im interesting in what would this be for you?

He can’t take a hit — 20% pierce armor and 30% hack armor make him take a lot of damage very quickly, even at the start of a fight. He also has low HP. His multiplier against myth units is lower than that of other Greek archer heroes, and I understand that it’s meant to compensate for the area damage, but…

The rest of what I didn’t like about him is just the design. Icarus arent even a real hero — the was son of dedalus..only…. He shouldn’t even be considered as a hero to begin with, and that bothers me a bit. It’s not like there aren’t other archer heroes who could fill the role…

[_MarakuJa]

@2gv

His upgrade should be removed so you don’t have to waste 300 food in classical, his special ability must be available from the start, same for the Hamadryad.

What do opponents do? Simple — they just send a military unit to your resource gathering, identify the ridiculous villager with a tail, and hit him once. He transforms into a werewolf, and now you have a dead-weight unit that can’t do anything until you get a super expensive upgrade for that specific age.

I’m starting to think something: there are pay-to-win gods, like Tsukuyomi for example… and now they’ve released a pay-to-lose one.

Edit 1: EVEN KATASKOPOS! 11111

[Urban_Hunter]

Here’s a short comics about upgrading archers.