You still talking about “nerfing french main strategy” - nerfing their healing rate by 50%
My suggestion is different - remove self-healing while moving and “buff” self-healing while knight being iddle, that would balance it in -theory-
I do not really want to “nerf the French”, I am thinking about adjusting the self-healing mechanic,
But that would encourage people to just let their knights stay around, do nothing and heal up. If you go knights you are forced to raid and need to have a high mobility like trying to attack from different angles to find out weak spots of the opponent. If you change that mechanic knights will not be an effective raid unit any longer. French knights are by no chance OP right now. It seems like people just (again?) have problems with getting raided, which is already highly limited in this game, but a normal strategic option in RTS games. People shouldn’t complain about strategies that beat theirs but find answers to it.
so french knights that spearman are supposed to counter them can just run free without worrying about their counter and heal up while running is a high brain capacity,
never bothering to make other units is a high brain capacity,
not being able to make an army composition and control only one unit type is a high brain capacity
spoken like a true french main
If it is so easy just do it and climb the ladder with it. Shouldn’t be a problem if it does not require any brains. Further, if you do not build any other units than french knights your not going to win many games. Usually you just build a few knights in the beginning, try to kill a villager here and there while getting a very good view on your opponents base in order to counter his strategy hence being one step ahead of him. Also spearmen counter knights by being way more cost effective and your certainly not supposed to follow the healing knights. It seems like you just haven’t figured out how to counter french knights and want to blame the game. Watch replays or pro players and work on your skills instead.
When it comes to skills there’s a wide range of abilities that define a top RTS player. And being able to raid effectively is certainly one of those skills.
I am not a french main but I like the civ since it is literally the only option to raid effectively in AoE4. What I would like even more is if it wasn’t that one dimensional. There should be atleast two or three strategic starter options for each civ.
People who constantly blame french knights should really stop it. The civ does already have an overall below average win rate so if anyone loses to french knights right now it is most likely because the french player was simply better.
If it is so easy just do it and climb the ladder with it
if you do not build any other units than french knights your not going to win many games
The civ does already have an overall below average win rate
you kinda answered yourself with this why french winrates are down, majority of french players spam only knights, they never bother to learn mixing army, simply because french knights is just too good
im not a tournament level pro but im a good player, i can even hold my own vs 2 or 3 players sometimes
the problem is that the only counter play is to baby sit your base with spears, if i attempt counter attack the french just find it easy to raid my base, and i cannot chase french knights forever so, if i do they heal anyway
outposts are useless against them since they are armored
walling off cant be done everytime, depends on the map, and it hard to wall off with abbasid with golden age mechanic
in short it annoying to deal with french knights simply because u are forced to defend, and simply giving them the attacker adventage, they can pick off your vils even if u have spears baby sitting them and beat your economy
I like the civ since it is literally the only option to raid effectively in AoE4
wrong, u forgot english Longbow & maa rush
english dark age maa rush
mongols dark age horsemen rush
or mangudais to destroy the enemy eco
there is the abbasid spearmen & archers & ram rush with military wing ( 15% more hp)
newly introduced ottoman military school pressure, archers & sipahi & mehter rush
malians have strong potential with cav rush after they buff them
HRE have MAA rush
Win rates for french are around 50% for bronze-plat league. For diamond and conqueror the win rate is lower at 47.7 and 47.1. Following your logic those players in diamond and conqueror leagues didn’t learn how to mix either since their win rates are even lower? Or can you explain why those players have such a low win rate with french if those knights according to you are just so good? People have learned how to mix them in pretty much every league nowadays maybe except for bronze.
I don’t care if your a good player or not, what your saying here is pretty dull and you do not seem to think alot before writing texts. Tbh you don’t sound logical at all. You just seem to not like the french knights raiding playstyle and that’s ok but no reason to call it stupid, brainless etc. Since your talking about abbasid: Abbasid have an extremely powerful window against french at around 10-13 minutes when their second TC and fresh food stuffs are up. They can literally spam out trash units and overwhelm the french player who has heavily invested in super expensive knights. I’ve just looked up the french win rate against abbasid here. Abbasid have a big advantage over french with only mongols having an even higher win rate against the french. Again you seem to be highly biased and it seems to be you who just didn’t find an answer yet but blames the game instead.
Longbows are too slow and thus vulnerable to be an effective raiding option. Dark age horsemen can be used but do low damage. Mangudai are just a very weak unit generally. I have rarely seen them being used. Can’t speak for team games though. Maa are too slow to be considered good at raiding. If you want to raid you need to have a high mobility and do considerable dps. According to your definition we could also build a tower nearby an opponents gold mine and call it raiding because it can be considered an actual attack.
You are right, that doesn’t make any sense and historical it doesn’t make sense as well, I would prefer better stats for french knights only, or better charge, the healing is just OP
100 wood
200 gold
60 secs
thats a huge early invest
Not saying the civ is bad, but it doesnt need any more nerfs at the moment. People just need to start paying more attention to their vills and defend better.
Towers, walls and spearman are a great way to deal with knights. Also you can counter raid with horseman since they are faster than knights.
Wait a min…how about we take advantage of this change to buff French?
Like royal knight can no longer heal while running but get massive healing while standing?
But do we really need this change? I am not pretty sure about that.
That would change the entire raid mechanic of the french knight as I’ve said earlier. If they only heal when standing still the raiding ability will be pretty much gone as those knights heavily rely on mobility.
in the middle of the fight Monk healing units, but “use logic” on French knights. WTF.
use logic with homing misles.
well they are healers
Say sike right now XD
What is the charge damage of a monk when attack the enemy woodlines?
what a heal of knight when attack the enemy woodlines? ZERO, save as monk.
I purely understand, that someone consider it OP.
but:
Ok let’s assume you removed. It’s pure nerf.
Should you just remove and do zero compensation?
For me it’s obvious you need to compensate such huge nerf of CORE mechanic.
as obvious compensation - impove healing rate.
Now: kts killed a pike => 80 second to fully heal.
With compensation: run a few tiles, wait 40 seconds => fully healed knight.
Or you just want all civs the same as in aoe2?) Just remove all unique techs, cause they OP. LOL.
Yes, but everyone else has far more expensive wheelbarrow, forestry, double beareded axe, and various other upgrades. Not to mention french got faster villager production speed.
Meaning all in all, dosn’t really add any “extra” cost.
serious? maybe we should talk about how many ranked games thread starter played, if the forum name is similar, exactly zero games.
If you look at the winrates a few posts above, I dont see any OP civ or any OP unit at knights.
If you loose against an opponent and he has ONLY Knights in his army, maybe you should change something in YOUR game and dont start any threads about healing, which was already nerfed hard.
Sometimes I think it would help if we see the elo of users.
As @AridSubset31991 said just watch the win rates for the french civilisation and there you have your answer on wether french have got an advantage or not. We have the statistics and they speak a super clear language. Ideally in order to find out if somethings out of balance there should be complaints from many pro players as well (e.g. vortix comment on too strong mongol tower rush in january). People really need to get over their subjective feelings when it comes to civ balance as it is just a horrible misleading indicator.
I haven’t complained about their winrate?
Only thing I mentioned is that nerfing it or to be more exact, that I agreed with the change susggestion the OP mentioned, wont really effect their winrate.
Heck, even less of an effect with their current low winrate.
And then i responded to the cost of Chivalry actually even outs when considering the reduced cost of various other techs and econ advantages french get. It evens out more than anything.
The cost of chivalry just prevents them from having it ultra-early which they used to have. So its balanced for the current intent and state of the game.
Still I rather see it be differently, i’m a more fan of having them to stand still for it to get into effect.
French isn’t the only Feudal knight harasser.
Rus can do exactly the same, and they are just as deadly in raiding, but requires more microing and manuvering. And nobody’s complaining about the RUS knights, because unlike the french, they are actually better balanced.
