German Buffs

Hi all! for long ago i´ve been thinking about germany and the several points in wich i consider they should be performing better, i wanted to post this before the germany “rework” if there will be any…

Anyway i thought this through and i´m just gonna put the changes i´ve been thinking about without justifying them because although all this changes are made by justification, it would make this way longer than it probably should be, and even then i think i could not explain everything as i see it, but i hope to explain it as well as i can in the comments, so if you have any doubt, complain, insult if you may, or piece of knowledge, experience, etc. that you would want to share, please, you are all welcome! (I also wanted to say that all changes are aimed more at the late game, rather than early game)

First, one of the most central points in germany, the uhlan. I´ve thought of 2 possible things for this unit:
The first is like my dream change to this unit, just because is on pair with germany´s identity and comes smooth with every other mechanic of germay in my opinion; although i don´t think this is probably the best option, first because it would change the uhlan´s identity quite much wich i never like to do although if the community is down to i´m also down to, but probably not because i would admit that is a little OP, mind you, i´ve made the calculations so it would be very very strong although not OP, less OP than TAD Gendarme, but anyway, i wasn´t gonna add this version but just to not keep it, i share it:

Population = 2🚹
Cost = 50F🥩/100C💰 —> 70F🥩/140C💰 (+40% cost)
Hitpoints = :heart:190 —> :heart:270 (+40% HP)
Speed = :footprints:6.75
Resistance = 30%:bow_and_arrow:
Siege Attack = 20💥 —> 35💥 3.00⚡ (+40% SG ATK from 25 wich should have been the Sg Atk of uhlan but whatever, this is not very important)
Melee Attack = 37🗡️ —> 51🗡️ 1.50⚡ (+40% ATK)
Basically just increases its cost by 40% but also its stats, this to make it like hussars that cost 200 resources, but this uhlan, as is with germany and their expensive units, costs 210 resources, so, in consequence:

Uhlan-Granting Shipments changes:
AGE I = 0 —> 0
AGE II = 2 —> 1
AGE III = 3 —> 2
AGE IV = 4 —> 3
It would grant less resources in uhlans in age II (300 —> 210), a little but less in age III (450 —> 420), and a little more in age IV (600 —> 630).

Logistician changes:
Now it increases the number of uhlans granted by 1 in all ages rather than only in AGE I and AGE II. The arsenal now grants the advanced arsenal card. (Advanced arsenal card is not removed).
AGE I = 1 —> 1
AGE II = 3 —> 2
AGE III = 3 —> 3
AGE IV = 4 —> 4
With this, the logistician not only would be more valuable because the increase is +210 rather than +150, but also its usage would extent to more strategies rather than just an age II intensive play, also, the age I cards would grant not that much less than age II shipments (1-2) like they currently grant (1-3).

Now, the above changes are a little over the board, so forget them, the next changes are my real suggestions for the whole civ:

Cost = 100F🥩/100W⚰️
Train Time = 25 seconds
Population = 2🚹
Gather rate = 2.00 —> 2.50
Train Limit = 20
In consequence, germany would start with only 2 Settler Wagons, or with 3 but with less initial crates, or with 2 and 1 normal settler, whatever you think it´s best, my aim it´s more at the late game.

In consequence, if people think in Treaty 40 or 60 Germany would get excesive score because of some of the below card changes:
Cost = 100F🥩
Train Time = 25 seconds
Population = 1🚹
Gather rate = 1.00
Train Limit = 99 —> 70 (or lower, as needed, maybe 50, 40, or just 20 to get close to the normal 100 vills, reason is in the changes on the germantown farmers card).

Logistician changes: (same as before)
Now it increases the number of uhlans granted by 1 in all ages rather than only in AGE I and AGE II. The arsenal now grants the advanced arsenal card. Advanced arsenal card is not removed.
AGE I = 1 —> 1
AGE II = 3 —> 3
AGE III = 3 —> 4
AGE IV = 4 —> 5

War Wagon now get +20% in Fortress Age
This change is not necessary, but i think WW are a bit underwhelming to be a german unit, and we´ve seen before units like the cuirassier getting the +20% when they previously didn´t, also that almost all light cavalry gets that +20%

Population = 3🚹
Cost = 150F🥩/150C💰
Hitpoints = :heart:500
Speed = :footprints:6.00
Resistance = 20%:crossed_swords:
Siege Attack = 30💥 3.00⚡
Ranged Attack = 42🏹 —> 46/47/48🏹 3.00⚡
This is also not entirely necessary, specially because i´m not that into light cavalry xd, but WW should be as strong as Cavalry Archers, if not more, so this aim is at that…

Germantown Farmers =
Settler Wagon = Trainable (No change)
Settler Wagon gather rate = +0.25
Settler Wagon build limit = +10.00
In consequence is the above change of normal settler build limit set to 70, because now germany would have 99+30(2)=159 villager pop instead of the current 99+23(2)=145 villager pop so now it would be 70+30(2)=130 villager pop although with the 2.75 gather rate it would be more like 70+30(2.75)=152.5 so honestly, you can set the limit to 50, so 50+30(2.75)=132.5 or less if you don´t want germany to have such advantage in treaty anymore. I would also say that i prefer that no politician give settler wagons, at least not to go to age IV or V, to avoid having 33 Settler Wagons for example.

Hand Infantry Hitpoints/Attack/Combat =
Pikeman/Doppelsoldner +15% HP/ATK/HP&ATK
—> Pikeman/Crossbowman/Doppelsoldner/Skirmisher +15% HP/ATK/HP&ATK
The card affecting the Pike and Xbow is not necessary, i include them to make germany a little less dependant of it´s age 3, and mostly because granting that to that units is almost nothing since you won´t be using them outside of age 2 but whatever, the main point is that it should affect the skirmisher, like the dutch cards.

Lipizzaner Cavalry = +15% HP/ATK —> +45% HP/ATK

Long-Range Infantry Hitpoints = +15% HP —> +45% HP
Crossbowman/Skirmisher —> Pikeman/Crossbowman/Doppelsoldner/Skirmisher

Spanish Riding School = +10% SPEED —> +20% SPEED

Treaty of Westphalia (Zweihander)
Requirements = Age IV/2000C💰
12 Doppelsoldner/Doppelsoldner +10% hitpoints
—> 10 Doppelsoldner/Doppelsoldner +20% attack
Honestly, this i didn´t plan to include, i would even remove any stat buff to not make dopps having too much hitpoints, but the +10% can stay, or i would argue that is better the +20% on attack because it makes it even more dependant on attack so it´s less OP that way but can go either way. If it´s the +20% is 75 melee damage, if it´s nothing is 70, originally i thought 70.

Solingen Steel =
+50% HP/ATK, -33% SPEED —> +50% HP/ATK, -10% SPEED

Population = 2🚹
Cost = 75F🥩/125C💰
Hitpoints = :heart:240 —> :heart:245
Speed = :footprints:4.50
Resistance = 20%:crossed_swords: —> 25%:crossed_swords:
Siege Attack = 60💥 —> 70💥 3.00⚡ (This change is not necessary, just to adjust a little with the new attack)
Melee Attack = 20🗡️ 3.00x🐴 2.25x🏃 —> 25🗡️ 2.25x🐴 1.75x🏃 2.00⭕ 1.50⚡
This is probably the change i would like the most to be changed, i think the doppelsoldner could really use some buff, and the main one is their attack, making it a little more of a swordsman and less of a pike, more like a samurai, or like a halberdier but a bit better, but this is one of the main things, and in fact, i was going to write the “Hand infantry buff” toopic before this, that is making adjustments like this one, but i bring this one up earlier because germany may be changed soon…


Population = 2🚹
Cost = 50F🥩/100C💰
Hitpoints = :heart:190
Speed = :footprints:6.75
Resistance = 30%:bow_and_arrow:
Siege Attack = 20💥 3.00⚡
Melee Attack = 37🗡️ 1.50⚡
Population = 2🚹
Cost = 50F🥩/100C💰
Hitpoints = :heart:560
Speed = :footprints:8.10
Resistance = 30%:crossed_swords:
Siege Attack = 57💥 3.00⚡
Melee Attack = 105🗡️ 1.50⚡

Population = 2🚹
Cost = 75F🥩/125C💰
Hitpoints = :heart:245
Speed = :footprints:4.50
Resistance = 25%:crossed_swords:
Siege Attack = 70💥 3.00⚡
Melee Attack = 25🗡️ 2.00⭕ 1.50⚡ 2.25x🐴 1.75x🏃
Population = 2🚹
Cost = 82F🥩/137C💰
Hitpoints = :heart:820
Speed = :footprints:5.40
Resistance = 25%:crossed_swords:
Siege Attack = 210💥 3.00⚡
Melee Attack = 70/75🗡️ 2.00⭕ 1.50⚡ 2.25x🐴 1.75x🏃

Population = 1🚹
Cost = 50F🥩/65C💰
Hitpoints = :heart:120
Speed = :footprints:4.00
Resistance = 30%:bow_and_arrow:
Siege Attack = 12💥 3.00⚡
Ranged Attack = 15🏹 3.00⚡ 20🎯 2.00x💂‍♂️ 2.00x🏇 2.00x🦅 0.75x🐴 0.75x🏃
Population = 1🚹
Cost = 55F🥩/71C💰
Hitpoints = :heart:354
Speed = :footprints:5.20
Resistance = 30%:bow_and_arrow:
Siege Attack = 30💥 3.00⚡
Ranged Attack = 38🏹 3.00⚡ 20🎯 3.00x💂‍♂️ 2.00x🏇 2.00x🦅 0.75x🐴 0.75x🏃

Population = 3🚹
Cost = 150F🥩/150C💰
Hitpoints = :heart:500
Speed = :footprints:6.00
Resistance = 20%:crossed_swords:
Siege Attack = 30💥 3.00⚡
Ranged Attack = 46/47/48🏹 3.00⚡ 16🎯 3.00x🐴 2.25x🏃 2.00x💣
Population = 3🚹
Cost = 150F🥩/150C💰
Hitpoints = :heart:1150
Speed = :footprints:7.20
Resistance = 20%:crossed_swords:
Siege Attack = 72💥 3.00⚡
Ranged Attack = 110/112/115🏹 3.00⚡ 18🎯 3.00x🐴 2.25x🏃 2.00x💣

The only one i might admit is a bit over the board is the skirmisher, and their attack was intended but their hp was not, although i think the age IV card is fine as it is, and actually, for reference, it would be the only european skirmisher that could win against a cassador, although cassador cost much less so cassador wins at the end, but i understand that hp is quite high…

For final note, i do know that you will be going to think i´m crazy and that “this is too OP” and too irracional, etc. i know that just seeing those buffs might sound crazy to buff a civ that´s currently strong and kind of balanced, but honestly, although they always have been strong, germany´s identity is the highest (and most expensive) quality units and one of the finnest economies also; and even with all this, their eco with the same villager population as french is even a bit less eco than the current french, so french is actually more OP in terms of eco, also french would even then have better artillery, better hand cavalry, and more variety of units, so my idea is to make germany in treaty as strong as french in treaty, because honestly that should have been since day one, those should be the of the strongest civs of all… Also, if i didn´t mentioned it, my buffs and all the intended changes are meant to be TREATY changes.


I will insert a few polls to make this easier i believe, but it´s my first time, if you think it´s not helping and it´s better without them i remove them if i can.

Logistician Changes
  • Yes, it is better than the current logistician
  • No, it´s way too good
  • Maybe with a few changes

0 voters

Settler Wagon Buff
  • Yes, it´s better than the current Settler Wagon
  • No, it´s fine as it is
  • I had something better in mind

0 voters

Uhlan Buff
  • Yes, it´s better than the current Uhlan
  • No, too OP
  • Kinda, i would think of something else

0 voters

Doppelsoldner Buff
  • Yes, it´s better than the current Doppelsoldner
  • No, it´s too OP
  • I would think of something better

0 voters

Skirmisher Buff
  • Yes, it´s better than the current German Needle Gunner
  • No, it´s way too OP, you crazy?
  • I had something else in mind

0 voters

War Wagon Buff
  • Yes, it´s better than the current War Wagon
  • No, it is fine as it is
  • Maybe something else

0 voters

why not make a new civ with these changes.

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giving uhlan melee resist will probably just make germany into an age 2 rush civ (though with a very bad match up vs musks) since they will always wins cav fight and give them enough HP to fight against pikes.

Yeah thinking about this they will just outright die to any musk civ with these changes.

1 Like

in what world do uhlans and war wagons need buffs.


Ohhh sorry, i didn’t see they had the sword icon hehehe my bad, that’s not changed, just their normal range resist, but thanks also for letting me know :grin:

Dude, you need to stop using drugs. No offense


Uhlans don’t NEED buffs like they are sole kind of bad unit, although there are some top treaty players that see uhlans like bad units, i’m of the ones that say that uhlans are pretty great, maybe even better than all hussars, but it do not compare with cossacks, gendarmes or some other strong cav unit, it doesnt even win against the hussar, but just because is a little cheaper it’s ok. But whatever, my point is that they may not need a buff that badly, but they can use one, and mainly it’s not because of the unit in itself that i think about this, but because the age IV card wich is not really worth it, in age III you have the exact same card but it also affects WW and all cavalry, so i don’t see the point in an age IV card with only +15% that only affects 1 unit, it’s almost like the Otontin Slinger card in age IV, is +10%.

For the WW as i said in the topic, its not necessary, also because they don’t need a buff, although if you compare them with cav archers, wich are not even like javelin riders or ERK so you can’t tell me cav archers are OP, they are just very strong, so cav archers, population wise, have the same attack and dps, although Cav A deal damage better because they get less overkill, also that WW have a delay when shooting, and the only thing WW have is like 13% more HP, but Cav A have more melee resist, and are waaayyy cheaper, they almost cost half the WW cost, when WW should cost only +50% so if WW costed just +50% more than Cav A i understand it, but they cost like +95% and it’s fine because German units are expensive but they are still the same as the way cheaper Cav Archers. I will say i don’t use light cav that much so i don’t really care much hahaha

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But they taste so good :pleading_face:


The only thing I would change about the Germans would be to give them some way to get modern units from the moment they reach the Fortress Age, it’s very strange especially in late games to see Doppelsoldner fighting alongside Needle Guns.


German is a civ very nerf, this civ need improves urgent


Yes, I notice that the Germans need a buff especially the Uhlans and the war wagons, in this way my 1v1 will become more feasible and playable :wink:

o que ??? voce e louco voce ja viu o vida e o alcance dos vagões de guerra tem eles ja são bons do jeito que são eu apenas daria mais uma caixa de madeira para eles ou mudaria o começo de 3 carroça de colonizador para 2 e mais 3 aldeões normais

Well you got one, well played.

The german Buff is the german rework that is coming

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I think the new winged cavalry card is very weak, it is recommended to increase from 6 to 7 or 8

And allow to train them in forts

Idk it doesnt count towards pop limit and they are ridiculous units that if hiding amongst the uhlans just shreds

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For me is good, I use them in my decks, has a value of 2.1k res and not cost pop.