Give Vikings the Ability to Train Berserks from the Barracks

Castle Age Berserks are pretty bad, so that’s actually the only time you do not want to make Berserks xD
Elite Upgrade is huge for them, giving them not only increased survivability, but also +55% (!!!) damage (which is even more % when you start to take enemy armour into account).

No, speed is a very important stat for melee units - also pop efficiency is not to be underestimated. If you just look at cost efficiency Champions are better, but the game is a lot more complex than that.

It’s not their main selling point, but it is still a very nice thing to have, especially if you get them into the opponents eco and run around there.

Once you get more game knowledge your wishes might change :wink:

So you expect us to be like: “Well, the very best players of the game use this strategy and it’s working. It’s also working for me, but then this random guy in a forum showed up and suddenly I realized that all the pros were wrong. His understanding is just superior to all of us. He made Berserks and it didn’t work for him. We should buff that unit.”

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At last someone understands! :grin:

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Yes, quite a lot actually, since they are both a Naval and Infantry civ, and also have great Archers.

I am, however, forced to wonder if YOU do.

give berserk +5 hp and call it a day

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i dont think that will do it (war) Chief

just to be clear, i find berserk to be a good unit, sufficiently better than a viking champion.

However reliance to Castles limits their usage and makes them a worse choice than champions as they are infantry units that need mass and sustained production .

Therefore allowing them to pump out of baracks would be perfect for vics.

I believe that vics could even lose champion then and be restricted to 2HS

making them created ultra fast would be another solution, like my beloved shotels (these really need some pierce armor or hp btw)

Yeah, exactly, 2 civs out of 35, it’s not something that it’s supposed to have all civs.

You can do with less that that, and as for their TT, they are on the same level of other infantry UU:

  • JW: 20(13)s
  • WR: 10(7)s
  • SW: 8(3)s
  • TA: 17(12)s
  • huskarls: 16(4)s
  • karambit: 6(4)s
  • samurai: 9(6)s
  • TK: 12(9)s
  • gbetos: 17(12)s

Berserkers takes 14(10)s are onestly in my opinion the best of those for how much flexible they are (good survivability, high speed and attack, cheap cost…).

I don’t really see why they should remove their UT for the regeneration (which is a ridiculously powerful UT) to give them a worse version of the goths anarchy.

I mean, goths need the infantry spam, they have to complement quality with quantity, but vikings don’t have the best quality of infantry, on pair only with Japanese (slavs slavs too, but only in post imp, which makes the vikings the best) and ahead of aztecs, burmese and celts.

But that’s an handicap of all civs, the only 2 who were given the possibility to use different buildings was 2 civs that had few options in their tech tree (goth that can go only for infantry, and huns that otherwise wouldn’t have any reason to use tarkans).

And still be OP.

But they work differently, they are a fast, cheap and spammable units though for lighting attacks, to snipe TCs and avoid any fights with tougher infantry.

Berserkers can literally melt through any units and have an insane survivability, making them super flexible at any situation.

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so first of all that i got it clear you like beserks as it sufficienctly better then a champion. but then again a beserk place is in the castle and a champions place is in the barrack that what differs both units besides their usage

i mean straight up i think 2 hands would be enough but then again champs as in their usage are fine aswell for viks and if they would give them 2hs i would say it a better reason to just adjust the beserk then like +20 hp 1 armor and 1 attack rather then making them being pumped out of the barrack

like before the usage of beserks and shotels differs in that beserk is a utility melee unit with good movementspeed and with the UT a bonus against cavs

as the Shotel warriors are just a high spammable glasscannon unit for massing

I mean yea they can scatter and replenish health or after the fight replenish health so its a gimmicky but interesting feature as it show the nature of viking soldiers

And it’s also very powerful, it’s really difficult to inflict losses on a army of berserkers, because they force you to go to for the kill, you can win with attrition or cost effective battle vs them, and if they are on the losing side, they can always retreat a replenish health.

the reason shotels (and karambits) are created so fast is because they are glass cannon units. no survivability, high mobility, high dps.

berserks are high survivability units on the other hand.

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on the other hand its pretty slow

He is much more faster than a champ, and faster than the average infantry and foot archers, the only infantry units that are faster are WR, condos, the lithuanians halbs and eagles.

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and karambits, shotels & gbetos.

i ment the regeneration speed

True, but those infantry fill different roles than Berserkers, which is more similar to a champs, and not even celts champs are that fast.

Ah ok.

Well it’s slower than the healing of a monk (about a quarter I think) but considering that it’s constantly active every time for every units, it’s actually a lot more efficient.

its still Gimmicky as hell as it serves for a temporary buffer as beserk dispearch and after some survive after a fight

And during a fight, they always regenerate, so if the enemy attacks isn’t high enough to overcome this they are basically immortals.

So lithuanian halbs and eagles do fill the berserker/champ role. Ok now I understood you.