I think Chinese need more buff

I’m not ethnically biased.I think every nation should have its own characteristics.But for China’s characteristics.I think a heavy price has been paid.

As a Chinese Old player,Compared with many European units.You will find Chinese questions are badly against Cavlry and Dragoon.Harass settler ability

As Chinese against Cavalry main force:QiangPikeman and Changdao.A bit of Cheap(60wood;95Food).But,it’s melee unit and only a half.Enemy only using more Cav and accompany a little Skirmisher or Musketeer.
Dragoon question:Chinese only a half unit can Ranged.So,Arquebusier is weakly against enemy Skirmisher.If they are Ranged.Please tell me:Changdao will attack or not?

Chinese StepperRider weakly against settler.Why?Please tell me Why?Only it’s 85Gold?Pay attention to:Chinese only a half of Cavalry

I admit that the training speed of Chinese troops is fast.But need all resources must be collected to train!China has become the most difficult civilization to play in High Ranking.

Chinese army is contract anemia.Some one said Iron Flail(In fact Iron only 370HP and need 240 Food).That’s a half!And it’s not good is accepted.

No Musketeer,No Dragoon(Don’t said Keshik),No High HP units.No speed

France can 12P go to Age2.Its efficiency It’s equivalent to 15 settler.only 3’50-4’00.Chinese need 4’40 only 17Settler and no 400 Wood.If Chinese stay age2.Tell me:How to fast train units?

Give Chinese some suggestion:
1:Village become 175wood,starting become 350 wood
2:Stepper Basic Damage become 20,against Infantry become 1.5X,Heavy is 0.67X
3:QiangPikeman Damage become 8.You can let Chinese age2 card 9Pikemans become 8
4:Keshik Damage Become 10.Why?Rof:1.5,8Damage ≠ Rof:3,16Damage.That’s why.Dragoon should Hit and Run,not stand.Obviously,Keshik is more difficult to operate
5:Changdao basic HitPoint become 140,Damage become 16,3X against Cavalry.11Changdao Card become 10
6:Iron Flail cost become 220Food,Basic Damage become 20,Hitpoint become 300

You can try to one by one attempt until finding an Good balance and not OP

7 Likes

It’s so important to China

About China my suggestion is need to have a unit that can take the opponent’s damage in Commerce Age

  1. Let China have a cheap way to train infantry outlaw-unit to protect Chinese Crossbowmen.
  2. Chinese Cavalry and Archer Cavalry become expensive and powerful. It is worth occupying 1 population.
  3. Commerce Age can ship two flamethrowers.

The problem in China is that “FF” is the most worthwhile practice.
Staying in the Commerce Age competition, you will find that the other units except for the Chinese crossbowmen consume very quickly.

2 Likes

China’s 2ages aren’t bad now, except Keshik is overly weak. Their FF is still strong enough. Controversy will arise if you buff that without considering it.

I agree.But,Giving Chinese Age2 strengthen,I think not influence its FF.Because if you FF,why I create Age2 units?

This is just another option for China

This is because China must have units to used cards when an enemy attack is expected. Units aren’t trained only for early attacks

I think Chinese need card.But,they xp near others and Chinese can’t Boom.So,Maybe FF is great,but,I think it’s not enough.Why?Single tactics is easy to be targeted.For now.Chinese stay age2 is not good choice

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i personally dont like china, on team games because they make 2 kidn of units, and other civs can spam only 1 unit, but china cannot spam only 1 unit they spam 2 units, and sometimes the second unti spammed is useless for fighting the unit that the enemie has spawn
i dont use china because i like to spam 1 single unti xD sometimes.

I agree and Vietnamesse tooo

Add the suggested changes to Russian and German consulate:

  • Russian consulate makes villagers 10% cheaper and train 10% faster.
  • Unlock the Food Trickle in Age I, the Wood Trickle in Age II, the Coin Trickle in Age III in the German consulate as opposed to unlocking Wood in Age III and Coin trickle in Age IV

Buff Flamethrowers and shipments of Flamethrowers:
Make them cheaper, give them more attack range when upgraded, just like how Jungle Bowmen, Abus guns and Gurkha receive more attack range when ugpraded. Their wood and coin cost is way too high given their poor performance. Its 170 Wood and 170 Coin. The 4 population cost is also too high, especially when comparing Flamethrowers to Leather cannons at 300 Food, 100 wood cost and 3 pop cost.

The stats of the flamethrower are simply terrible given their cost. Flamethrower shipments are very poor value.
Someone who posted on reddit did a great analysis that will everyone help understand why Flamethrowers are so terrible.

Flamethrower analysis: read below.

There are some major tweaks that I think Flamethrowers need to become more viable and less niche (currently being tested in my legacy mod):

1). Speed. 4.25 just isn’t enough, especially considering they only have 10 range. 4.5 is the bare minimum they need to be in order to catch up with most infantry.

2). Population: They cost a massive 4 population, and even though China gets 220 military pop, it’s still quite an investment. Reducing it to 3 would make them less painful to use, especially early on, when China gets housed easily.

3). Cost. Flamethrowers are prohibitively expensive to make, costing 170 Wood and 170 Gold (the hardest resources to obtain). Converted into villager seconds (0.84 Food/s, 0.6 Gold/s, 0.5 Wood/s), you’re looking at 623.3 VS. For comparison’s sake, a Leather Cannon is 300 Food, 100 Wood, or about 557.1 VS. And a LC has over double the range and more AOE, making it a far safer unit to use. Going so far as to compare it to a Falconet, a Falc costs 100 Wood and 400 Gold, or about 866.7 VS.

So a Flamethrower is roughly 72% the cost of a Falc, but it’s significantly worse, lacking the range, siege, and raw damage of the latter.

Therefore, I’d suggest 150 Food + 150 Wood as the cost of a Flamethrower. It puts it down to 478.6 VS, which I consider to be a much more reasonable cost.

4). Awful shipments. Given their inflated cost, their shipments are quite…pathetic. 2 Flamethrowers in Fortress? That’s 680 resources, which is just barely better than a colonial shipment, and the Industrial one is 4 Flamethrowers, or 1360 resources. Given that Flying Crows are much better units (although they have significant scaling issues due to their colonial-age stats), there’s no reason to send them over those lategame.

Therefore, I’d suggest adding in a 2 Flamethrower shipment in Colonial, buffing the Fortress shipment to 3/4 Flamethrowers, and improving the Industrial shipment to 6 Flamethrowers.
It is very high in resource value compared to other units, but since Flames are rather niche, these need to be worth more to compensate (much like other power shipments - Lakota’s Uprising, Portugal’s 5 Organ Guns, Sweden’s 5 Leather Cannons, etc.).

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I agree with most of it. I wouldn’t make them cost food tho, but the food equivalent of what they actually are worth into wood and gold.

On regard to the consulate, maybe make the intervention shipment for Russia ship 4/5 goons (which is in power equivalent) instead of the cossacks that people extremely rarely ship. I would also change the option to recruit goons from the Age IV army that nobody uses because how expensive it is, to at least the Age III one (and move the cossacks or hussar to age IV with the 3 culvs). It’s also worth noting that the current Age III army is the most underwhelming army pop-wise from all the equivalent options.

This would help give more variability to playstyles (than going Brits consulate every game) and give China a way to get goons to deal with cav, while still keeping their weakness to cav, since export is hard to come by.

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