Ideas to improve infantry... again

Supplies and Gamesons affects all infantry units
Supplies changes to 10F reduction
Gameson changes to +1/+1 armor

The idea is to make the barracks upgrades more meaningfull and not restricted to only 1 unit


-M@A upgrade from 100F 40G 40secs to 100F 30secs
-LS upgrade from 165F 65G 40 secs to 150F 50G 30secs
-2HS upgrade from 300 F 100G 60 secs to 400F 100G 45 secs
-Champs upgrade from 750 F 350G 85secs to 800 F 250G 60 secs
(Total saves -135F 155G 60secs)

-2HS and Champions speed changes from 0.9 to 0.95


-Base cost changes from 35F 25W to 40F 25W
-Pikemen and halberd speed changes from 1 to 1.05

The idea is kind of force players to research supplies if they want to counter cav with pikemen, but as it will be a extra invesment and some civs don’t get supplies (very few) and other do not have gamesons (the majority) they need to be slightly better


-Base cost changes from 25F 50 G to 35F 50G
-Only aztecs gets gamesons (is no change from the current patch, but I wanted to clarify it)

Not a lot to say here, eagles are a very cheap and powerfull units, It wouldn’t be nice to make them even cheaper with supplies, it’s a very small nerf for Mayans and Incas. On the other hand aztecs eagles with gameson would be a nice buff to a civ that has been falling out of grace for quite a while and it will be balance with cheaper and quicker champions

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Jaguar Warrior amor changes from 1/2 (2/2) to 1/1 (2/1)


Dismounted Konnik amor changes from 0/0 (1/0) to 1/1 (1/1)


FR cost changes to 700F 400G
FR gives up to 10 FM from each TC (max 40 FM), in addition you can recruit FM from barracks


First crusades now gives up to 5 sargeants for each DONJON (max 50 sargeants)
Sicilians can research Hoardings in Castle Age


Elite Berserker armor changes from 2/1 to 1/1

May continue soon…

I wish the classic militia line (not legionaries) had +1 MA. Effect starts from long swords onwards though.

What is the reason of it? you dont force Skirmisher to research Thumb Ring to counter archer, and you dont force Scout research Husbandry. Go for countering unit have weak tempo even though they research more tech later and I am not sure the reason why increase the initial price of countering unit


Infantry line is fine.


I’m fine with the Gamberson +1/1 I don’t think paladins should beat Champions with equal resources

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Honestly, I don’t like supplies nor Gambesons, of course they help to infantry playing, but in my opinion they are bad designed, feel like patch techs… If something would be changed with these techs, I would do this:
-Supplies: Change effect to reduce pop space for militia line and move it to imp.
This is a way to give infantry play somehow viable in late game 1v1 and TG as a power units, not only a “trash counter” pseudo-role. This could or should comes with a champion upgrade buff and rebalancing the availability of this upgrade, making it a more rare upgrade (at present only 10 civs lack of Champion which says too much about the poor impact the upgrade have overall if you compare it with Paladin or Arbalest)
-Gambesons: Just merge its effect to LS Upgrade to offset the lacks of supplies’ discount.

Really like the gold cost removed for MAA upgrade and general costs tweaks. But I would add a unit cost change too. From 60F 20G to something like 40F 40G.
This would make infantry smooth to mass in early game for the food cost reduced and balanced in late game for the gold cost rised (taking in count the new supplies effect).

I like but just for Champion upgrade to make it more unique.

Don’t like it. I think pike line is fine. If you rise its speed you bury even more elephant playing.

No need either.

If you change Gambesons to:
Militia line takes -50 % Damage from Siege and -50 % Bonus damage. (stacks with Sicilan bonus)

This would make it interesting to use

There are only a few Infantry counters out there but those who do usually own them. On the flipside giving them extra pierce armor generally nerfs xbow utility against them which I think is a really flawed choice, as this weirdly leaves many archer civs with no real counter against infantry + siege. Whilst HC will still be devent against the miltias even with losing half of the bonus damage.

With the way how gambesons is currently implemented it’s clear it’s only for mass militia play which is still rn way too easily counterd by siege (unless it’s the goth flood, but that’s different scenario for the very lategame).

I hate to say this, but I think “Supplies” is a total failure. Militia line could just get a plain 5 or 10 food cost reduction.

It is too early to judge “Gambeson”. But the major tournament after the inclusion of the tech, KOTD5, still didn’t have much militia line play. So at least I can say that the first impression is not looking good. And most of the play came out from Malay and they are about to lose “Gambeson” in couple of weeks.

I forgot to mention “Arson”. This is an utter failure that is floating around the game for 10 years. You will forget to research this 90% of the time unless your main army is Eagle Warrior as you’ll add siege to take down important buildings like TC and Castle anyway.


Both Supplies and Gamesons are a total failure because they only affect 1 unit, it’s not worth it.

Another option it’s to reduce the militia cost 10F and change SUPPLIES to infantry use 15% less pop and GAMESON to affect all infantry units as the very minimum

But the main problem of militia line still is that it’s too expensive and time consuming to upgrade, if they are not supposed to be good, let them be cheap

Mmm… I think the devs considered to avoid to directly buff militia/m@a rush. This tech is meant to buff longswords.

Yeah, I think it can be directly given to Castle age infantry unit.

Supplies is fine, but research time should be instant. I don’t like any of these techs affecting pikes and halb though. Halb are already really powerful in the late game. Giving them extra buffs would make them OP.

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My idea:

  • Militia-line’s speed is increased from 0.9 → 0.95.
  • Longsword/THS/ Champion’s pierce armor increased from 1 → 2.
  • Gambeson tech removed and civs without Gambeson now don’t have Champion upgrade.
  • Hand Cannoneer’s bonus attack against infantry increased from +10 → +13.

For me the biggest issue for the current infantry is that they have no ability you can use for micro.
They are just spam units atm.

And that’s only solvable with giving them something scaling with skill to gain an advantage over the opponent. Something that makes them so valueble you care to keep them alive like knights and archers.

And that’s also why supplies sucks, cause it only makes them more easily spammable, so you care even less about them whith this tech.


Maybe with the upcoming PUP ram buff, jumping in and out from the ram is kind of micro. And ram+Militia line will be a popular way to handle Castle in Castle age

You’re asking so much that it will mean only infantry can rule AOE2.

Can’t agree more. Rebalance THS and make Champion an exclusive upgrade.

I initially agreed with this when DE came out. But the way meta developed in past 3.5 years, I think a general cost reduction will be fine.

if Infantry can build ram on the field without siege workshop like in aoe 4, I think they will be seen more often.


Yes, It would very interesting.
Another crazy idea is add a new siege capturing mechanic. Instead of just dying what if siege weapons becomes available to be captured but only by militia-line.
-Only Siege killed by non-siege units become capturable.
-After a a couple of seconds if is not captured then definetly dies.
-only one militia unit is needed to capture a siege weapon. After capturing the soldier dissapear and the siege weapon turn into player.
-Garrisone mechanic is the way to capture a neutral siege weapon.

Very unlikely, infantry are the easiest units to counter +1/+1 won’t change that
I don’t think there is a single civ that doesn’t have at least 2 units to counter any full infantry composition

All the changes I proposed are focused on making them powerfull in late game, and most likely only civ with heavy bonuses on infantry would win with mostly infantry.

I agree. Militia line needs a new mechanic and not raw power. We can’t just keep pushing for basic buffs and then end up having a strong unit with no trash counters in castle age.

I was thinking maybe give them the ability to slow enemies when attacking. This would make them a bigger threat when killing villagers and knights would have to think twice before engaging them.

Maybe this would requires a stat numbers rebalance thought.