If the Japanese get added, here's some examples of what their unique units can be

The Japanese are likely to be added to AoE4 in the future and because of that, that got me thinking about what some unique units are the Japanese going to be having. Some examples include:

  • Samurai - A unique infantry unit that replaces the Man-At-Arms. This proposal is something that everyone isn’t surprised to see or think about because the Samurai was common throughout the Middle Ages (which can pretty much explain why the Japanese civilization from AoE2 also has the Samurai as it’s unique unit).
  • Yabusame - A unique mounted archer available at the Archery Range.

In my Japan Civilization concept. I suggested replacing scout unit with a Shinobi. (Aka Ninja). Now that Stealth is going to be a new feature with the Malian Civ, this should be fully feasable.

Daimyo’s as a special Khan like unit that gives supportive benefits to your armies, could be limited to 1 or more Daimyos depending how one wants to emphasize on it.

Samurai unique unit: NOT A MAA replacement. Katanas were NOT the samurai’s main weapons. It is sidearm for self defense purposes, when other weapons are not adequate.
Samurai’s were mainly Archers, Spearmen and Cavalry. Henche why I suggested Samurai to function as a Infantry version of a Rus Lodya ship. A unique unit able to switch between Weapon types. while being categorised as Heavy-unit. (Archer, Spear, Maa, Knight)

Another unique quirk that could be given as a Imperial age upgrade is the Tameshi Gosuko (“Bullet tested”) armor, granting them reduced damage from gunpowder weapons.

Unique Naval units such as the Sengoku and Atakebune.

Also with the fact they are willing to give civs compelte unique unit rooster.
There is no stopping giving Japanese a Unique unit rooster.

Deviding between 2 warrior classes.
The Samurai (Heavy armored, expensive gold costing units)
Ashigaru (Light armored, cheap trash units)

So regular archer, spearmen and handcannoneers would be Ashigaru.
And if you feel rich and need extra strong units: Samurai version of these, for archers and handcannoneer versions, thats when they use their Katanas in melee. (Same way Strelskies switch to melee in melee engagement)

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I made a Japanese Civilisation Concept last year and I plan to rework it once I tested the new Civilisations.
Now they are adding a civilisation that only has one generic unit (the Archer) and at last 5 unique units.

One idea could be splitting the Japanese units into Ashigaru (Simple foot soldiers), Samurai (Knights/Elite units) and Sohei (Warrior Monks) that are each trained in a different building.


Shinobi are spy, not soldiers, they don’t go to war, James Bond DON’T go to war.
This is not Red Alert 3, thank you.

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Isn’t that exactly what he proposed?
A scout and not a soldier.

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A scout is EXACTLY a soldier.
A sniper pathfinder unit is a soldier, a CIA agent is NOT.

Ninja in the other hand is a warrior, so im gonna stop you there. :laughing:

Awesome! im glad there still people who wanted to see japanese as new civilization. Domo arigato banzai!

Scouts in AoE are barely stronger then a villager. They are not soldiers.

But espionage and exploration aren’t that different.

I don’t like the idea of making them scouts but I don’t think it is wrong for the reasons you said.

I think they should complement the scout and not replace it. Late game intelligence gathering.

What are you talking about?
In what universe did you live where people didn’t want Japan?

Sorry, I don’t think you understand what’s Shinobi, and what they really did in our REAL history.
Unless you learn this from anime or movie shows.

I don’t think you know what a Scout does.

A Scout is a riding or light armoured man, whoes main job is surveying the battlefield or possible location for a incoming fight.

A Shinobi, which was a spy, who disguised as farmers or commoners, doing their daily life jobs as a peasant, meanwhile gathering useful classified information for their lords.

Dude, I can’t help if you can’t tell a difference.

Not the same but you could use a Shinobi instead of a Scout in AoE.
A unit that infiltrates the enemy vs. a unit that scouts the enemy.

The Mongols start with a Khan instead of a Scout. I think that’s a bigger difference.

I don’t think the Shinobi should be a Scout replacement though.

AOE4 team built the game based on REAL history and REAL historians unlike the copy and paste AoE2 just stuffing a castle units into it, have some value tweak and call it another faction.

Shinobi does not fit in a war, they would avoid this historical inaccuracies.

I’d make them a unit that can use stealth without a time limit but that is kinda useless when discovered (as strong as a villager).
They considered adding a Spy unit to AoE2 that would look like an enemy villager, but they decided not to.
SC2 has the changeling that looks like an enemy unit until the enemy click on it.

I like that idea, shinobi units will gather resources for enemy and reveal enemy base but will be caught if click by players or attack villagers.

First of all, let me begin that you are being way to aggresive in your posts and personal insults is completely uncalled for.

You are completely wrong that Shinobi’s were never meant for war.
They served a plethora of purposes. And you saying that CIA agents don’t involve themselves in war or in more particular, Combat related to war, as someone who’s had experience of working alongside CIA, I have a surprice for you. But that is a offtopic discussion for another time.

Regardless, Shinobi partook in just as much Espionage, as they did in Assassination, be it for political reasons getting rid of political rivals in peacetime, or war related reason, weakning or removing enemie leadership.

They also played an important part in Wartime, especially during siege, as they would often infiltrate, sabotage and partake in disruptive raids, and could also be Mercenaries to supplement armies, especially during the Sengoku Jidai.

I don’t know where you learned your Shinobi history from, but any Japanese historian coming out from TOKYO U would tell you the same.

Iga and Kōga clans were famous for having well trained Shinobi’s, some of these Shinobi’s became rather famous/infamous in the region as well.

infact, if you read up on the Shimabara rebellion, the Shinobi’s from Kōga were employed by Tokugawa, in order to quell the christian rebellion holding up in Hara Castles.
Shinobi’s not only infiltrated, did reconnesance, spied, and sabotaged. They activly took part in battle during the assault of the castle, having already pre-positioned themselves in an ambush to deal with guards on the towers and walls.

The Gunpo Jiyoshu manual, written in 1612 and revised in 1619, is considered a truly accurate account of life inside of a warring‑period samurai army, where shinobi are clearly defined and considered a part of the contemporary war machine.

I don’t know what else to tell you.

Now for all means, we can argue and discuss how the use of Shinobi’s are to be used in a Game mechanic.

but also counter-arguing about REALISM serves no purpose when it comes to AoE.

If you think AoE devs are operating 100% according to history. Then you are mistaken. Many things are not according to history at all!

Just look on the latest Mali-civilization addition.

The Malian never had Gunpowder. It was due to the lack of gunpowder weapons that they eventually collapsed and taken over by the Songhai Empire. (who also didn’t employ gunpowder weapons)
The Malians were actually quite desperate to get hold of gunpowder weapons, they sent envoys and emissaries around to both portugal and ottoman empire to learnt he ways of Gunpowder weapons.
While they learned how they were used, they never managet to obtain any weapons for themselves.

YET, in AOE4, Malians have unique gunpowder units and even Culverins and Bombards!

Yes AoE4 uses a team of historians to help do reasearch and supplement the game.
But they don’t make the game 100% according to history. Which is a good thing, as in the end, this is a game.
While I am all for making things “historical Relevant”. I’m no fan of making things 1 to 1 realism.

I think the Malian having access to Gunpowder is Historically Relevant.
Because they did have training in how to use them, they were fully aware of them, and they were also Muslim, and holding a vast library of knowledge from the Muslim and outside world. So it wasn’t that they didn’t have access tot he knowledge. They had the theory, they just lacked the practical implimentations in order to wield gunpowder weapons en-masse. It was just cut short by the aggression and takeover by the Songhai. who proceded to burn these libraries ontop of it all.

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A wall of text with 90% of irrelevant information, don’t you?
If they include Shinobi into the game, it is JUST Starcraft Dark Templars, for killing Vills, PERIOD.

It is SILLY and NOTHING relevant to your “took part in battle during the assault of the castle”, this game is NOT Stronghold, there is no Lords for you to assassinate.

I could totally get behind a ninja unit for the Japanese, possibly as stealthy scouts. After all, who doesn’t think ninja are totally sweet?

As for the samurai, I remember reading somewhere that they were typically mounted archers rather than foot soldiers as portrayed in AoE2 and 3. In which case, I’d prefer to see them as ranged mounted units, but with a melee ability as well since their katana are so iconic.


Apparently you have some vandetta against Shinobi’s. I don’t see the point in arguing further on this matter.

The whole point of Shinobi’s for the sake of AoE4 is just to be scout unit with extra utility. I do not see an issue with that.

There are many units in AoE that isn’t “realistic” compared to thier counterpart.
Mangudai having to go point blank in order to fire their bows? kekw.
Monks running around healing people with Praises? Tbh, Monks didn’t really serve as front-line medics in warefare.
Janissaries being only able to use trench-guns? Infact trench guns? What? Trench guns didnt even exist in this era. They used Arquebuses and early muskets.
Musofadi Gunners, a unit that never really existed untill the 18th century.

If anyone is having dark templars in this game, its hte malians and the Musofadi warriors.