Is the game balanced for Ending Age = Castle Age?

[SauravT]

@WoeIsToWho

I don’t understand whether you’re arguing that the Aztecs are viable or not, it’s not apparent from your statement.

I am talking about Imperial Age.

[MustySnizl]

@CactusSteak2171

I think the Franks would be dangerous but mostly because of their cheaper castles to abuse their resilience in castle age.

That is an additional point of course. Yeah they would be worse than lithuanian knights, however Franks in Imperial Age have the weakness of lacking Hussars and both Imperia archer blacksmith upgrades, while Lithuanians get all of that. Teutons are indeed buffed in the same way though. Franks were just an example of how the castle age benefits cavalry civs over archer civs.

[SauravT]

@CactusSteak2171

archers

Thumb Ring is Castle Age tech. Bloodlines is Feudal Age tech.

[CactusSteak2171]

@MustySnizl

Franks were just an example of how the castle age benefits cavalry civs over archer civs.

I suppose throwing the arb+chemistry power spike out of the window sure doesn’t help.

@SauravT

Thumb Ring is Castle Age tech. Bloodlines is Feudal Age tech.

Yes, it’s not ideal to lack those, but better just lack bloodlines/thumb ring rather than bloodlines + plate barding armour + literally every archer upgrade except chemitry and HCA.

[WoeIsToWho]

@phoenix1089

we still have to apply current games to predicted outcomes, aztecs can be just as aggressive as they are now knowing that the opponent can not tech into imperial age power units… they can know that if the opponent creates CA thats it, no masssing and teching into PT HCA with extra range or paladins or even superior arbs

I can tell you, right now, without any doubt, the Aztecs are horrible in castle age only games. Once the castles are up the aztecs can’t push, and if the Aztecs don’t push, the opponent masses pop-efficient units and wins.

@phoenix1089

the aztec skirm is literally the best skirm in the game hands down in castle age.

Doesn’t matter, they don’t have an answer to LC raids. Practically the only way you can lose in Castle age-only games is by losing enough eco to not sustain units or by abandoning your castles to defend your exposed resources. Once the gold runs out the LC can’t be tracked, defend your eco or defend your castle. Aztecs have no options. They can’t raid and can be raided. That’s a losing matchup against anyone with a stable.

@phoenix1089

yes they will still have the same issues they have now if the game drags out into imperial and gold runs out… but they have those issues anyway

Yes, but now they can’t kill a castle to prevent their gold from running out before the end of the game. Having units that can kill a castle is really important, and no civ has that option in Castle-age only games. It’s just way, way worse for meso civs, because when the gold does run out, which it absolutely will, they can’t answer LC efficiently. Their monks are pretty crazy but no Block printing in Castle age means it doesn’t make a real difference when castles control any position worth fighting over.

[CactusSteak2171]

@WoeIsToWho

Having units that can kill a castle is really important, and no civ has that option in Castle-age only games.

Cuman are the best civ then?

[ReanuKeeves00]

No, absolutely not. A bunch of civs are super geared towards imperial age play, so such civs are instantly trash tier. Many unique units are pretty useless in castle age, and only become viable once their Elite upgrade/UT kicks in. There are also some civs that will be kind of OP, because their imperial age is garbage, but have a really strong power spike in Castle Age.

[WoeIsToWho]

Yeah the Capped ram is a serious problem unit, but Petards and Mangonels are just unmitigated terrors under a castle in castle age. Rams are the only unit that can assail a castle in castle age at all but that doesn’t mean it’s effective since units tend to handle rams pretty well.

That’s why I think Mongols are probably unkillable. Best LC in the game + Anti-siege archer meaning you don’t even have to supply fragile anti-ram options like mangonels. You probably won’t ever kill the Mangudai, and even if you do the LC raids are going to be absolutely vicious.

[SauravT]

@CactusSteak2171

Yes, it’s not ideal to lack those, but better just lack bloodlines/thumb ring rather than bloodlines + plate barding armour + literally every archer upgrade except chemitry and HCA.

You know the best part? Celts lacking 2ManSaw is not a problem in Castle Age. Making them the best water civ and one of the best economies on land.

[CactusSteak2171]

Age of Empires 2 Meat Grinder edition

[WoeIsToWho]

Basically. A few friends of mine had a game of Castle-age ending age, and I didn’t participate. Fortunate for me, the game ran for four hours.

[SauravT]

Castle and Krepost HP needs to be reduced to make it easier.

[WoeIsToWho]

maybe in games where Castle age is set as the ending age. Not generally. But definitely an option in that specific setting.

[CactusSteak2171]

I don’t think they balance around such games. I mean, look at Cuman in feudal only games 11

[WoeIsToWho]

Who can beat Goths in dark-age only games?

Edit: Eventually running out of gold.

[CactusSteak2171]

Burgundian can try to out eco them ig LOL

[WoeIsToWho]

So… Goths can make 20% more units for the same resources… But Mayans have 20% more resources to spend… But you can’t kill a TC with Militia… But Douche… But Defender’s advantage to relocate…

This mode was not made for human comprehension.

[EvilLordMrF]

@Chandrika4321

unique units not getting a visual update on elite upgrade feels a bit out of place.

They should have sprites with a tiny golden element. Like golden helmet, or golden shoulders, etc

[superzgred]

One of my most disliked campaign scenarios are castle age siege. Civs don’t have good siege options for castle age. Beacuse of that every castle age game is boring - it is just spamming weak units against other weak units and avoiding castles, because those cant be taken down fast.

If castle age should be playable then siege units should be doing more dmg to castles, or castles HP needs to be reduced.

[ReanuKeeves00]

Petards. They can take out castles