It is absurd how strong this holland is

It is stupid how defensive it can be, using the banks as walls of 4000 resistance, guerrillas in second plus the militia card, it is brutally difficult to penetrate them, more than anything the annoyance is that they can obtain a lot of gold while even under pressure. , The thing in third is brutal that I can take out many troops with a cost of gold and at the same time send mercenaries that obviously cost gold, it is an absurd enrichment of gold, Lately my confrontations are 60% with the Dutch of the total of 17 civ that are in ranked that means people already know you are super strong and will probably increase your rating easily. They suggested that they return the 15% gold collection as it was before, and also lower the life of the banks a little, it is a building that its objective is to obtain gold NOT to use it as a wall, and that I am a 1v1 player not to mention as a team how powerful it is

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Banks cost 700resources for 4000hp, walls cost 5 wood for 2500hp… i dont think hp of banks should be lowered, since they cost a lot and are like 50% of the dutch eco. If you lower hp of banks, Dutch players will just use walls instead. Overall dutch seem quite ballanced…

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Hahahahaha so not only you want to make it inviable again, you want to nerf it further than how it was. Dude if you cant Rush dutch thats your issue not the civ.

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Claro un lammer como tu no entenderia como ganar sin bonificaciones

No me parece adecuado que justifiques su vida por su coste, siendo un edificio de inversion, Lo normal es que los jugadores intenten derribar rapido a los holandeses por su economia exponencial, un holandeses tiene suficiente herramientas para defenderse, pero debes entender tambien que 4000 de vida es demasiado para un rush en la edad 2, los piqueros europeos tienen 32 de asedio necesitas 125 piqueros para poder destruir un solo banco, en 1 ataque, para que lo llevemos en una situacion mas real necesitas, hacer aproximadamente 13 ataques de asedios con 10piqueros para destuir un banco, no te parece insolito? Por lo menos que la vida de los bancos progrese mientras pasas de Edad, pero entiende que 4000 en colonial es mucho

tbh i dont care about bank hp or how much coin the dutch player has. if you use your pikes to destroy his military production buildings and houses, he can have a million coin and it wont change anything. Baracks have 2500hp, destroy it instead of the banks

edit: if he is walling with banks, houses and walls (he needs gates ofc), dont attack the banks and focus on the other buildings. (break through Banks and destroy Barracks:) 4000+2500Hp vs. 2500+2500hp (break through the wall and destroy barracks) vs. 1200+2500hp (break through House and destroy Barracks)

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What’s this new mod of writing in spanish in an english forum ? I find it a lack of respect for the majority of people who do not speak spanish and for people that make effort to speak in english even though it’s not their native language. Do you want that only spanish-speaking people understand what you are saying ? Should I start writing in french so that 10% or so understand me ?

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There is a little Globe Symbol, that autotranslates to english. Its quite good, i used it to understand the post above

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Ridiculous that comment friend, if I speak in Spanish it is because the lexicon is lost when translating it, Also the translator on this page in my opinion is much better than the others, of the times that I have commented in Spanish no one had ever told me anything because it costs nothing to press a button to translate it

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Yea exactly, imagine if you spent 700 res just for it to be burned down as fast as a tp

Wow i need this button, where is? my english sucks…

PD: okk nice find! I hope people will press that button instead of complaining, I could provide much better comments

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This comment makes no sense whatsoever. If you want to evaluate a civ, you need to understand their strenghts and weaknesses. If you are proposing a ridiculous change then you must be prepared for people to confront you.

If you dont want to rush dutch fine. You can even call people lamer because they use strategies that exploit the civs weaknesses … The point is that against some civs (dutch, Ports, Chinese, Spanish etc.) if you let them prep, they will be superior. That doesnt mean they need nerf, that means that when fighting them you need to adapt your fighting style.

That still doesnt m

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Nor does it make sense for you to say that I cannot beat the Dutch if you don’t even know how much my elo and my win rate is, I know that you are main Dutch because I have seen you in other posts talking about how it costs you to beat the Indians using the Netherlands , If for you it is enviable that they return to 15% the gold collection, it had been by far the worst civ since its launch, it only responds like a parrot because you are not able to accept the strength of your civ that is played alone, I am not demanding a cheeky nerf only to reverse the unnecessary buff they made, I don’t care much about lowering the resistance to the bank

The truth is that the Dutch question makes me think a lot about what happens with this civi, I must admit that it is quite powerful and you realize because many ranked players use it very often. Sometimes it is difficult to assault them, more when they use the Town Militia card in the first age. If they arrive at Fortresses it is gg, in a short time they can mass units very well and quickly and take out several cannons. Maybe if you need a little nerf, but I would not know what to propose. I have to admit it’s a bit frustrating that they lock themselves into their 2x2 square and just hang around bouncing to fortress age and taking out a lot of units, more so if you are a native civilization and you don’t have ranged siege units as efficient as cannons in most cases. Likewise, I recommend that you start playing with the Dutch and begin to see their style of play and weaknesses first hand, it is one of those civilizations that is difficult to balance.
PS: The boy is right, you must choose your source language in your profile editor and use the translation button, it is a great tool that makes me love this forum!

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I have a bit of a crazy idea, but I’m already a bit tired of Dutch unit spam … I think very seriously that Dutch military production should be limited. What they referred to me is to place a production limit on certain types of Dutch units and reduce some numbers of shipments in fortress age. First of all, set a limit of only 5 falconets, I realized that most Dutch produce irrational numbers of falconets (between 10-15) if you are a native or Asian civilization, there is not much to do against that. Then, and this is not too much, but you also have to do something with the numbers of ruytiers, sometimes they can produce 50 of these types in a very short period of time and it is insane. I propose this, because normally one tries to prevent the Dutch from reaching fortress and completing its bank boom, but if it manages to arrive, only with the banks and a couple of shipments it already has more than enough to ruin you. To that we must add that if you go to lategame, they start spamming falconets and that is already very sad.

What you are saying is that having the rest of the map with hunts mines and trees is not enough? The whole gameplay with dutch is turtle boom (you do not have a viable rush). And that strategy has several flaws/weaknesses

Dutch do not have the 2 falc shipment, and at an early fortress can be killed with mass hussars (yes mass huss > ruyters and skirms).
Why would the devs put a cap on cannons? at what time do they pop the cannons? if they are going fortress you can go fortress and counter their cannons as well (arrow knights, bow riders, culvs, flaming arrows, Siege elephants, hand mortars…).

How is this different than the standard strats for every civ? if you fight azzys they will skull knight you at 5 mins, either you survive or lose. If you let the Japanese/Sweden/Brit complete their shrine/House/Torp boom they will overrun you, if you let the chinese do their FF or FI you will also lose…

Dutch lategame is bad in general. Compare it with Brit, Port or French. Any of these civs can use their Factories to make Heavy Cannons. Dutch actually need the factories on resources due to their vil cap of 60.

Not saying that the dutch are not strong. They are strong. But they are not OP, not even in the slightest.

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Dutch is perfectly fine right now.

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I already know that it is an extremely unpopular opinion that I have, what happens is that I don’t usually play with European civilizations, I play with native civilizations, and it is really difficult to defeat civilizations like the Netherlands, British and Japanese, who can handle an irrational amount of artillery in a very short time, that’s why I came up with the crazy idea of ​​limiting the amount of artillery they can have, to avoid this kind of abuse against civilians that have it very difficult!

I think the answer to mass artillery, if it becomes a problem, is to do it japan style:

  1. Nerf across the board to artillery (except maybe the heavy ones from factory, which are hard to mass anyway)
  2. Distribute strength to other units

Although even with native civs, I don’t see artillery as an issue. In fact, artillery are a must have against them, otherwise you get overrun.

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But Native civs excel at killing artillery.
Hauds have a culv+falc artillery that is simply OP
Lakota army composition can effectively counter artillery (from bow riders to rifle riders to the Warchief having +600% attack vs artillery)
Aztec can counter with the arrow knight EZ (and with the new discounted arrow knights in age 3 they are even better)
I dont know Inca, since i dont play them, but cant chimu runners take care of artillery?

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