Make laming bannable in 1v1

i wish those smurfs get banned.
smurfing is not an intended mechanic.

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Isn’t it tied to player skill though? if you have forward boars, you should go get them as fast as you can if you think there’s a possibility of laming.

Just saying. I never lame myself but also never get lamed because of this, if the boar is forward i’m gonna get it as soon as i can. Most people these days just follow Build orders mindlessly, and when something goes slightly different they get tilted. 6 to sheep, 4 to wood etc etc. The other players also know this, best way to ruin build orders is to do something that’s unexpected, hence the laming and super early rushes. Why not 6 to sheep, 1 goes to get boar, 4 to wood and carry on from there?

I’m not against it or for it, just saying that there are ways to stop it from happening in the first place. :woozy_face: Playing against Goths for example you gotta expect laming and mindless murders to take place in the first 5 minutes.

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I agree with the rest, the game starts at 00:00 not 05:00 or 07:00. Anything you can do in the game is a legit tactic.

Why not make attacking the enemy before he goes imperial bannable as well?
Or scout rush and archer rush bannable?

If you want to play a safe early-game play Arena.

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It reminds me of this:

I literally had a game like that a few days ago. What the heck is with these people. He kept spamming “help” and I kept spamming “delete wall”.

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Then just play Empire Wars

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Have you played vs Teuton tower rush on Arena? :laughing:

  1. 1200 is not extremely low elo, it’s above average.

  2. if you’re smurfing at 1200 elo what right do you have to complain about people playing anyway they like?

You should be banned for smurfing

10 Likes

i think this might backfire, the moment you find your own boars you know where your opponents are, so laming might get easier instead. Im not sure about this, but a change like that might not play out as intended

why in a game that recreates a war like situation stealing your opponent potential resources should not be a thing? it’s not good sportmanship in a game and i can agree on that, but definilty has its place i think

Laming is part of the game. Same like walling in resources and other approaches to throw the opponent off-guard. Keep in mind that it is always an investment on the side of the laming party, whether it is in scout hp, villager time, or APM.

That said, I personally do not like to lame. I never do it actively (except for taking sheep when I find them by accident) and I always ban maps where laming is extremely strong (such as Socotra or Haboob). But that is just personal preference, I wouldn’t enforce my view on others.

Exactly. If you look at some matches in the recent KOTD4, you’ll see that many times the lamed re-organizes his economy/strategy and, at the end of the game, the lamer loses

Devs don’t care that’s the real problem

Small update: there is a “deep water” tournament going on, where people start (in dark age) with 9 villagers instead of 3:

I remember GL.TheViper and GL.DauT (among others) talkimg about the Empire War game mod and how it could be…

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What does this have to do with the thread?

I got confused because I thought I posted this on the wrong thread. I was just lokoing for the thread complaining about laming in 1v1, and where people sais that Empires Wars is the right mod to avoid laming.

The point of the comment was: if a game mod “starts with 9 villagers” arrives in the game, this game mod will prevent laming because with 9 starting villagers you can pull boars much earlier than the opponent scout can come to lame.

But maybe I am on the wrong thread again.

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probably since there is only 1 boar and you start with like 4 sheep only, laming is impossible and yet other Dark Age shenanigans like drush FC etc. are still viable.

for those that don’t understand why laming is impacful, here a small breakdown (again I’m talking about Boar laming, I saw someone post comments about Celts etc. but sheep laming is rly not a big deal and who cares about that).

Let’s say you are something weak like Burmese or Magyars, with only ONE time window before Castle Age/Imperial Age to create a lead. In general, in AoE, if you are 2 min ahead of the opponent in terms of Age progression, or 3-4 vills ahead, that’s considered a substantial lead. Generally at high level, players don’t risk being aggressive when they have a lead and prefer booming instead into a faster Imp time which always allows to pick your opponent apart much more safely with superior tech (Trebs, Arbalest, +4 Cavalier etc.). Each civ has ways to create this type of lead by different means (Vikings, through free Hand Cart etc., Burmese through early MAA damage that translates into them hopefully getting a faster Castle Age time, Magyars though Forging Scouts etc.). Civs must respect these windows and you can’t just improvise a window to create a lead at high level (for example, all-in Britons Knights isn’t really a thing and you wonder why you didn’t pick Berbers if you wanna play like that).

Now onto the specific example, let’s say you are Burmese vs Franks (a top tier civ but not super top tier in 1v1): your only window to create an advantage is your +1 attack MAA, Franks is strongest in Castle Age and maybe Burmese get a small lead again in post-Imp. Due to lacking Boar, you are forced to drop at least 2 farms, which means no 2nd lumber camp or mining camp on gold (probably u can’t afford either too early). The 1-2 deer you pushed to justify the MAA also get negated by the boar being missing. Basically you can’t afford MAA anymore! Which again is your only window to do damage. You are forced onto the defensive whole Feudal, Franks player probably does Scouts → Archers or Skirms so you need to do Spears and Skirms to defend. On semi-open maps, walling completely before Scouts come is fairly hard also. In short, fights happen at your base, your CA time is delayed, you will likely face a forward Siege workshop and you are lucky Burmese have a good Monastery which probably can sort of fend off Mangonel play to a degree. But still you are forced onto the defensive, as opposed to being the aggressor, for the next 30 min, all because of an unfair act.

Of course if you are like Vikings vs Burmese, and you get lamed, it’s not as relevant though it’s still relevant. Vikings is so strong that you can still be the aggressor even through a boar lame. But that’s the exception to the rule.

We all know the impact of laming, but that isn’t the issue - theoretically either side could lame, so it’s “even”.

The issue is that in most games, both sides assume the “gentlemens” agreement that they won’t lame, and that holds true. But every now and then you get lamed, and by the time you realise it it’s already too late to respond to. So suddenly it’s a totally one-sided, unexpected situation that loses you a couple hundred resources.

If people who like to lame could somehow declare that they may lame this game, then it becomes fine again. For example if you’re playing vs MBL, you know a lame could happen, so you can play with this knowledge. At any ELO below 2k, people don’t tend to know their opponent, so you don’t know if you’re opponent may be inclined to lame.

Edit: the simplest solution is to have a couple extra boars and sheep on the map that are “neutral”, that way laming losing its power as there’s more food generally available in dark age.

Another alternative is to stop scouts being able to attack boars (in the same way as they can’t attack deers)

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Simple? That “solution” would mess up the entire balance of the game, e.g. by buffing mayans, mongols, britons, other mezos but also by hugely rewarding early aggression.

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Qoute "Isn’t it tied to player skill though? if you have forward boars, you should go get them as fast as you can if you think there’s a possibility of laming.

Just saying. I never lame myself but also never get lamed because of this, if the boar is forward i’m gonna get it as soon as i can. Most people these days just follow Build orders mindlessly, and when something goes slightly different they get tilted. 6 to sheep, 4 to wood etc etc. The other players also know this, best way to ruin build orders is to do something that’s unexpected, hence the laming and super early rushes. Why not 6 to sheep, 1 goes to get boar, 4 to wood and carry on from there?

I’m not against it or for it, just saying that there are ways to stop it from happening in the first place. :woozy_face: Playing against Goths for example you gotta expect laming and mindless murders to take place in the first 5 minutes. "

Perfectly put, Thank you

4 Likes