Map selection real problem AOE2 DE

Age of Empires II: DE II - Report a Bug
21

Presently you get 3 bans and one favourite So the maps that are neither banned nor favoured are effectively soft-banned. I think if your opponent doesn’t have a preference once you find a match with them, you will get your favoured map. If that’s not the case, it should be like that.
However, I like the idea of ranking map preferences.

You said that ideal system would allow lobby games to be ranked, but also that we shouldn’t show unranked elo. Not sure how one goes with another. Do you mean we should have two different lobbies - ranked and unranked?
IMO, showing unranked elo in the lobby wouldn’t be too much of a pressure on people.
But if that’s a major concern, why not make an option to opt-in to have your unranked elo shown in lobby games.

22

With all respect, i dont consider that giving to UNrank a rank is a solid solution for the map poll problems.

23

What’s wrong with having a functioning ranked lobby for people who wanna play specific stuff like back in the days? They could make showing the “lobby elo” opt-in.

24

Thats not the problem! chosing an specific map with rank is the solution, but why split it into two systems? and why you would have to get excluded from the matchmaking system and go to the old and frustrating lobby mecanism for chosing the map you will like to play on?
Remember that “back in the days”, although memorable by nostalgia, doesnt mean a good system, means a good system for that time.

The problem is that the map poll system isnt good enough, i dont consider a viable solution to have two mediocre ones.

25

That’s a good point, but as I said before, the current system is already a compromise. It’s difficult to make a system that works for all. You will hear a lot of people complaining about it, and I’m not trying to delegitimize their concerns, but the issue is that creating a system that suits them would break the current system and I think it’s very difficult to make a matchmaking system that works well with unlimited bans. Maybe in some other game with a lot more players at every skill level it would work due to sheer size, but AoE has to be careful not to fragment the ladder to much.
In any case, I don’t think we know enough about the challenges that devs would have, this is just my feeling.

Personally, I’d rather wait 3x1 minute due to alt-F4s than get bad matchmaking.

26

the soft bans idea is on top of the ban/favorite system. just add another category, a soft ban. if in a team game 2 people’s main ban is identical, one of these’s soft ban becomes his main ban.
or, soft bans just remain a less favorable choice. for 1v1 it goes like this:

  1. main bans are never chosen.
  2. if a map was favored but not banned/soft banned, choose it.
  3. choose 1 map out of all the maps that are: not soft banned or are soft banned by 1 player but favored by the other player (basically, if you soft ban the other guy’s favorite map, it becomes a neutral map).
  4. if no maps existed in steps 2 and 3, ignore soft bans and choose 1 out of the not banned maps.

so this system is very similar to the current one, but gives a higher chance for the players to play the maps they prefer, even if not their favorite map. for team games this would be a HUGE improvement.

27

These issues were already debated on the Zone and they remain unsolved until today. The truth is, that Microsoft has huge problems to interact with their own community and to be clear with my statement: Dear Microsoft, when you ask “popular” players / streamers and influencers what to do, then you ask an interest group which does not even represent 1% of the community and you do the opposite of what you intended to do e. g. listening to your community. – Wait, I forgot, this is not possible, because your platform does not offer the ability to chat and interact with each other. Oh darn, how could that happen? (sarcasm!). SCNR

While I have to admit that this is easier said than done, I can however also tell you, that the best thing is to offer multiple solutions which were suggested by the community (even if they conflict with each other) and then follow “your” community and see, where the majority goes (simple trial and error!)

At this step, most people will certainly ask: who is this guy? Well, I was a Zone.com SysOp and Member Plus until 2006 and I am also the guy who is currently in charge of Voobly, which I co-founded in 2008. Some people may also remember me from this thread: Wake up Microsoft!

I think the easiest solution would be offering multiple ladders. You could still keep your existing ladder system and call it the “pro” ladder or whatever, but you have to add additional ladders. On Voobly we learnt, that most new players and rookies like to play Black Forest only (for obvious reasons) and they like to play it with friends and they want to be protected from noob bashers / smurfs (important for new players, while new != bad).

The second step is offering a ladder for open maps, while Arabia has turned out to be the most popular map here, followed by Arena, Land Nomad etc. And of course you must give players the ability to decide, whether they play team matches or 1v1 and whom they want to play with.

The community also loves to play ladders which are more casual than competitive, the idea behind this one is the simple fact, that the community uses ELO as indicator to play with other players of their skill. It does not necessarily mean, that they want to play competitive - they just want to have fun.

And then last but not least, you can offer inter players and higher to play the current ladder in its current configuration. Keep in mind though, when reading those lines, that I do not play DE. I am sharing something that works very well on Voobly for many, really many years already.

What you shouldn’t do: don’t introduce pain points such as bans if the community does not use your system, as - well “intended”. Also don’t try to tell your community what they should like (you are not Apple!), instead give them what they want and learn to serve multiple groups and also multiple generations of players within your community.

If you setup the ladders as proposed above, it might also be a good idea, that people who instantly quit the game, lose points. People who manipulate their rating should be dealt with separately, same goes for cheaters.

Speaking of pain points, my name also still appears to be censored by the profanity filter. Why don’t you offer players to verify their age through XBox and remove the annoying profanity filter for them? And why is the profanity filter still - well “buggy”?

Another thing that is really annoying me on this forum, is the habit that “negative / critical” feedback keeps getting deleted / closed or otherwise edited. Feel free to go ahead and do with my post what you feel is right - I don’t care.

Actually I am just replying to this thread, because the OP has asked me to do so. Thank you very much for your attention.

3 Likes
28

Honestly, if voobly had a server based multiplayer system, i never would have left. Im from the middle east and have a high ping from basically everyone, and especially from south America, which the majority of voobly players are from.

29

This statement represent a problem that i have seen since i started in the inseders forum, i even ask a moderator if the threads had even been read by developers. You are “contributing to your favorite games ”, " will work alongside the development teams" but minor problems like the spectators chat had been adress multiple times by the community and still without answer.
The response i got was that they are reading the forums but typically do not reply to reports other than to acknowledge them. I want to know if and issue hits the devs radar, if its something they would act on or if it will stay the way it is.

If its known that users close the game because it finds a match in a map they dont want to engage, you got a problem, your community wants to chose were to play. The system is clearly dont working as intended so change it! Dont expect the player to work around it.

I dont believe that my propouse of letting you select the maps that you want to play would be embrace by the entire community but at least try different alternatives since the current one is not working.

It seems that they launch the game with a new matchmaking system and the player base would have to be glad that at least we got one. Its disappointing to see a community intrested on making the things work, offering different solutions, trying to upgrade the players experience that in the long run would attract more users… and waste it. Feels like throwing a bottle at the sea, i prefer to do it but every second it passes ,the idea of getting an answer vanish more and more.

30

The same story they were telling us on the Zone already. lol

To quote a good friend from the Zone Team: you must keep in mind, that there always exists a five years product lifecycle. What they don’t fix or release in the first 12 months will never be fixed or implemented, because there is no budget for such stuff. And of course they will close it down after seven years or stop supporting it (as they did with AoE II HD or the Zone) and move on to the next project.

It’s also important to understand how they work. The web site and forums are usually maintained by their “WEB team” and a couple of volunteers, so none of the DEV people are involved and it’s not like you could directly talk to a developer here. Also there are multiple DEV teams and they just get a list of priorities and to-dos in their meetings.

There are also rumors, that parts of the development is actually outsourced and they of course just do, what they get paid for. In other words, there are no developers who could directly interact and play the game together with the community and understand their problems.

Two years ago I really expected, that they would reverse their decisions from 13 years ago and that we would celebrate the come back of our beloved Zone. Perhaps I am just getting too old for this. Good old times on Zone. sigh

1 Like
31

There are user commenting in this forum marked as “Forgotten empires: Dev”, so supposedly the actual devs are commenting here and reading the reports.

also, a new dlc will be released soon, and its been almost a year and a half since release so they are still putting some work into the game.

1 Like