March Patch Wishlist

Dynasty landmarks are 15% cheaper than the Age-up/ first choice counterpart

  • Chinese have tough time getting high-quality units fast.
  • Nerf grenadiers by increasing their cost by 50% and decrease range by 1… this unit will be broken when Ming can be reached quicker.
  • NoB bug fix

Stepp Redoubt gathers 30% more gold. A significant reduction. It still should gather a bit more than IO supervised gold.

  • This landmark feels as if it were a pack-n-go Regnitz. The idea is that they do not swim in gold and be able to spam sieges and lancers at the same time. If Mongols double it up with Silver Tree (or just trade), they get way too much gold.

Idk how to balance out Eng quite yet, but here goes: Armor Clad also works for Knights.

  • English faces a brick wall as soon as opponent ages up to Castle and start pumping out MMA and knights/lancers. Suddenly, a mass of longbows you made in Feudal begin to feel outdated. The idea is to have melee units for English be a slight bit superior.

Burgrave palace gives all Castle MAA upgrades for free upon completion and no longer creates units in batches. Instead, it just makes units 5x faster.

  • First, I don’t know why coming out in batches is a thing. If I want just 2 landschneckts mixed in my MAA ball, why can’t I make just 2?
  • The idea also is that Burgrave should be a reactionary landmark. Regnitz should still remain superior choice IMO. If HRE lost map control in Feudal, and getting at least 2 relics isn’t going to happen any time soon, then HRE should be able to make a judgment call: Make Regnitz and sit with a worthless landmark and try my luck? Or do I go full military and try to end the game in Castle with superior army composition?

Tune down Swabia: Still 20% cheaper, and still produces villagers -75%, but the villager production time is decreased to 200%.

Elzbach palace gives additional -17% less siege damage bonus to buildings in influence. (-33% for torch, -50% total for sieges).

  • As if -33% damage reduction is any good against bombards.
  • Maybe you got stuck in Castle and you decided to make a 2nd TC to boom along with more prelates. You have 7 prelates, 1 in Aachen with farms all around, and other 6 camped along gold and wood lines. Swabia doesn’t make too much sense at that point. But Elzbach is not really an option, because, again, -33% is nothing. This just makes it more attractive.

Shorten imperial upgrade times by -10%. It’s still a bit ridiculously slow.

Reduce efficient production time bonus by 50%.

  • the power scale in Castle is way too quick for Delhi. Delhi win rate is like 65% at 20-24 minute mark in general, 73.5% at 15-19 minute mark in >1600. 20 mins is basically 10 or so minutes after reaching Castle.
    -Efficient production, combined with the fact that you save money on upgrades, makes Delhi ludicrous. You build stone towers all over the map while at the same time able to pump out sieges and elephants almost immediately upon reaching Castle… before opponents can react. Just delaying battle-tipping units like mangoes and elephants by just 10 seconds or so could do some good.

Make stone walls available in Castle.

Abbasid, Rus, and French seem to be in a good place.

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Small wish:

  • Reduce Map size for team game, especially 3v3 and 4v4, give an additional choice for large map.
  • Remove Black forest and Mountain pass from random map pool.
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no nerfs to mongols? (Ovoo & Kahn)

Agree with everything else though. There probably needs to be a nerf to feudal Rus water and a buff to late game Rus water.

Also buffs to some weak landmarks like abb of kings and tower of victory

Oh and fixing the scoring system. It makes no sense.

I also wouldnt mind of mangonels has 1s slower animation so you can react a bit better.

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Nerf Mongols (Ovoo only possible at age 2)(there early game needs nerfs)
Buff china landmarks (cut cost of Dynasty landmarks in half)
Fix NOB bug
Buff other less used Civ’s like English
Nerf siege (for real this time)(buff counters to siege more)
Remove maps like Blck Forest and Mountain pass and all water maps

Increases patches to 2 weeksfor balance and 1 monthly big patch for bugs and added quality of life to content

They are going to try to have each civ into the mongols level , that’s why no nerfs .


. treaty mode
. walls with more health
. new maps


Delhi dark and feudal techs should be a bit slower. And imp techs should research a lot faster.

Chinese secondary landmarks need a much bigger discount than 15%. 15% amounts to 60/30 in feudal, 180/90 in castle, and 360/180 in imp, which equals a total of 600/300 after about 30min when they get into Ming, or 20/10 resources per minute on average. Not even nearly helpful.

Regnitz and Swabia need nerf, while HRE need feudal / castle buffs to encourage them to stay in the feudal / castle longer.

Buff camels.

what? You mean villager production time increased? I think this landmark is broken when combined with regnitz. They can throw as many villagers as they want to reach castle and collect relics and just sell gold and go imperial and you have all villagers back even more than opponent. Also picking villagers are useless against HRE. You are pretty much wasting your unit time. They can re-pop very fast very cheap.

Stone towers moved to castle.
Stone wall hp halved until an Imperial upgrade to 7k hp
Stone walls takes 15 seconds for standard villagers to build, 10 seconds for Chinese villagers and 30 seconds for delhi infantry.
Stone towers still takes 1min to build and hp unchanged.

Melee units all attack on the move OR have a catchup mech after each successful strike.
Improved pathing for all units.

Khan range is significantly reduced vs villagers only.
Mongols start with 5 villagers instead of 6 to offset early ovoo production.

Start with a prelate on the field and 50-100 less starting gold.
Regnitz can only store 2 relics, has a base gold generation of 150 gold/min, and each relic adds 250 gold/min for a total of 650 gold/min.
Burgave batches 2 units at half the time it takes to que 1 standard unit i.e. que 2 maa at 11 seconds. (Yes it’s actually slower than patch of 5 but it allows for more resource diversity).

All the camel surprises promised!! Hopefully with some house of wisdom tweaks.

Longbow start at 6.5 range instead of 7. Can upgrade in feudal to 7. Longbow out ranging towers and requiring an upgrade is not interesting.

Dynasty is 30% cheaper

Fishing rates all nerfed to account for not having to dock Fishing boats after each batch. Still make them avg higher than normal ships.

Transformation of ships take longer and units can not gather while transitioning.

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I don’t think Regnitz needs a nerf. It is so hard to dunk all 3 relics in after certain ELO. Players get so good at contesting relics. It’s also a landmark that you are forced to rush, sacrificing unit count, leaving HRE vulnerable early game. It should be high risk high reward landmark. In fact, I want more of the game to be as high risk high reward as Regnitz.

When people get used to being more aggressive, Regnitz will feel balanced.

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I don’t think the analysis should come from total resources saved. It should come from the angle of: “how much time is saved?”. For instance, saving 60/30 is a fair bit of time. 360/180 is still a little bit of time when you are queuing up imperial units.

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I am afraid I cannot agree with you on your suggestions on Chinese, except the NOB one. I played China almost 200 hrs. The problem Chinese is facing now is Chinese has all kinds of special units but do no better than its vanilla version. I understand that Dev was trying to make some special units that not just better than usual units, since, i guess, they do NOT want players will never make usual horseman after they can access to FL. However, I think this is a wrong approach. Special units should be better than vanilla version, period.

Zhuge Nu is more expensive, but only deal non armor units better than usual archers, but has less movement speed and range. I would suggest to make them actually as crossbow units, replacing usual crossbowman (means chinese cannot make usual crossbowman any more). If doing so make them too strong, just make them more expensive, or reduce general damage output a bit.

Fire lancers are totally useless now, due to their low movement speed (even a bit slower than Lancers), no armor (horsemen have 2 piercing armor), no bonus on archers, but more expensive than horsemen. They are not hit and run units, rather hit and die units. I would suggest make them replace usual lancers, share the same stats as usual lancers but deal some aoe damage, during charge, and good at anti sieges. Just make sure they will NOT win fully upgraded French knights in 10 vs 10 situation, for example. And they cost as much as a lancer, hence ppl won’t be able to mass them.

Making grenadiers more expensive is impossible, since they already are the most expensive units as knights. Maybe make them more gold heavy. They are also not that OP now, since they have no armor and they are range units, that are heavily countered by mounted melee, not to mention Mangonels.

Palace guard is just a worse version to MAA of any civ. The 1 armor reduction is huge, especially at early age. Since it can mean soaking double damage against archers. So, I would suggest make PG cheaper than MAA, or more HP at the beginning not after some upgrades. Just to make them can fairly fight a same res vanilla version.

To summarize, Chinese landmarks are just useless comparing to other civs’, so my suggestion is building them is like to unlock some special upgrades on crossbowmen, and lancers, with some universal benefits. PG need to compete well with vanilla MAA with same res.

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  • Delhi infantry no longer can buildnstone towers with compound of the defender. Honestly the ability of having military units to be able to build a massive tower that shoot springald arrows is what is making them broken in age3. Loose one fight and you will have stone towers all around your base.

Please read this thread

Longbow start at 6.5 range instead of 7. Can upgrade in feudal to 7. Longbow out ranging towers and requiring an upgrade is not interesting.

sorry, I dont think so, look at the stats of england. They need something at age 3, becausee all longbows are nearly worthless against the MAA

I am not sure if you have actually checked those numbers before you state them.

First, five min give back what you pay for Yuan is impossible. During that time period, let’s say you have on average 80 villagers constantly and effectively gathering res, 40res/min, that’s 16K res. Hitting yuan cost 1.8K res. You are saying that 15% movement increasing will give you 10% increased on res gathering? impossible! 5% increased will surprise me. Not to mention achieving Yuan will slow down your villager production speed if you previously get Song.

Second, 12 buildings arong spirit way? SW is 4X4, production build is 3X3. Do it cleverly, I can fit 8 around it. Plz enlighten me how to achieve 12.

Finally, FL not slow after movement improvement from Yuan? For speed, normal horseman 1.88, knights 1.63, after yuan FL 1.72 (from 1.5), still slower than horseman. Not to mention, China can make even faster horseman during Yuan, than why FL?

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You can build production buildings a tile (two also working) away from the landmark to fit more buildings

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Really! Good to know, thx. But it needs a space of 12X12 in your base, which I feel kinda impossible on a 1v1 map anyway.

You mean production building can be built one house away from SW and still get the benefits? That’s good to know.

True, I think chinese is one of the civ where you need to plan the base structure wisely like to have those imp. Academy affect most buildings meanwhile close to the TC for efficient tax collection. Also need to affect some of the building next to spirit way as well. But the fact is none reaally care about tax that much after 10 mins.