My takes on the last patch

Hi! After the last patch has been released, I have some takes about that I would like to discuss with you regarding some bonuses to some civs, so let’s start:


Honestly seeing a good civ like Vietnamese received 2 buffs at once for a civ that literally doesn’t need any bonus was a big shock! The least thing we can say about their new 100% faster techs bonus is just it is a very very very strong and HUGE buff, it is honestly a strong buff to the point of absurdity for a civ didn’t literally need it at all! To a civ that is A tier in Viper’s list! I really hope this bonus will be nerfed in the future or even removed! On the other hand why the imperial skirms received a buff to their upgrade? No sense and weird buffs! Why? Who is the low elo legend who suggested to buff Vietnamese and why the devs did it?


Imagine a civ that has one of the strongest eco in the game received eco and also military buff! Yeah! Their market now almost like Saracens market and their UU received a buff imagine! Who is the low elo legend who suggested to buff them and the devs listened?!


They got a buff! Yeah! One of the best civs in the game received a buff imagine! Why? Who suggested or even thought a civ like Britons need a buff? I know it is not that much impactful buff, but there was no need!


They also received buff! Byzantines! One of the strongest civs in the game! Top tier every where! Being picked or even banned every single tournament! This civ actually need nerfs not buffs! I know these buffs also not that much impactful, but there was no need!


The nerf is good, one step to the right direction but honestly I doubt it will change the general situation for Chinese, they need somehow to lose more things.


Making Manipur cavalry in castle age is maybe too much strong? But let’s see.


Very weak nerf for a civ that is now literally S tier. A civ that has a great advantages from dark to imp, so instead of nerfing their gold discount or faster techs or berries or navy the devs nerfed Fetotria! Yeah Fetoria needs a nerf anyway but the civs need many nerfs in different aspects.


Buff to Konnik?! Buff to one of the best UUs in the game?! It just makes no sense! Now pikes and camels will barely be a counter to this unit. It is just totally broken now.

I will write a balance suggestion topic for many civs later, and it will be a long one and I hope the devs will take it seriously.

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Vietnamese have consistently been in the lowest tier of civs by winrate at every skill level except the top ~10 players for years. I guess we’ll see if this ends up making them OP at the highest levels, but I doubt it.

Britons have historically had a full barracks. Not much more to it than that. If they’re to be missing a tech, it should be from elsewhere.


The Vietnamese are not good. Historically they’ve been terrible.

No, it’s not. The Chinese are the worst civilization for casual players, and this nerf will hurt them even more. It’s only pro players who struggle with fighting against the Chinese.


Vietnamese have been the absolute worst civ by winrate at most levels for ages now. Even for the top 1% of players, they’re among the lowest ranked civs. Of all the civs in the game, they were the most in need of a buff.

I’m pretty sure the Viper is not an idiot, so I can only assume he’s being deliberately misleading with that list.

Maybe someone who actually looked at the winrate stats rather than assuming that what the Viper said applies at all outside of a tiny handful of pros?


He’s not misleading or an idiot. It’s just that things are totally different in the pro scene. Pro players are never gonna understand how the game is for the vast majority of players, as they are significantly better and understand the fundamentals better, so civs like the Chinese will trip them up less.

I dunno, the devs nerfed the Chinese, so clearly someone is still listening to the pros. I hope they mostly disregard what the pros say in the future regarding balance, because they’re the exception, not the rule.


The replies really tell the truth and confirm what I mentioned in the topic. That low elo legends opinions are always wrong and it will destroy the balance if devs listen to them. Too bad.

This reply comes across as really arrogant and superior. That’s not helpful for a forum where the majority of users are “low elo legends.”


This confirmed that democrasy is not the perfect solution to humanity. Because if the majority is below what is required, it will be a disaster for the entire society.


That last comment really isn’t helping your case. Why don’t you let people who are more casual give their input and stop putting them down all the time?


Balanace should be always around the top players and high elo, since it will bring the fair match up and better balance and fair play. Low elo legends suggestions will make the game way worse since they don’t have that much knowledge, nor experience and do a lot of mistakes and mostly they don’t even play ranked that much.

If you want to listen to LELs then believe me you will see them suggest to buff civs like Mayans, Aztecs, Chinese, Britons, Vietnamese, Byzantines and Portoguese (unfotunately the last 4 ones got buffs in the last patches).

I will also make a balance suggestion topic and I hope the devs will listen like they listened to LELs.

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To be fair, it’s the start what hurts casual players… but if you practice it, it’s a really good civ… and it’s not that hard, a 11++ or 12++ shouldn’t have any problem to have less than 50 secs of idle TC

They should have changed the start of the civ, but many on the forum didn’t like it because it was “unique”… Unfortunately chinese will continue to be overwhelming for many and op for very few players that pick them

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I think the best way to achieve balance is to look at winrates across the various gamemodes and look at what everyone has to say, not just pros or not just casuals.


That’s true. I already have the Chinese pretty much mastered and I don’t even play ranked.

Disagree. In a game that has so many civs and all have the same basic units, it’s important to differentiate, even if this results in extreme deviations.


People know about the start though. What I think actually gets them is not knowing what to actually do with the civ. There’s so many options, and no bonuses to steer players towards any of them, and for a lot of people, that can actually be quite problematic I imagine.


Malian are similarly unfocused and they arecquite popular though


Exactly. I think people really like jack-of-all-trades civs, because they can be played in a wide variety of maps and settings, with a wide variety of strategies.


Please 2. Literally (almost) everything in your post is so wrong to the point that I am not sure if you are trolling or being serious.


We have seen some absurd suggestions even from someone of high elo. Then no one should give suggestion lol. This forum can be closed down.


Dude you are so obsessive about nerfing every civ.

Did you forget their range work rate bonus got halved? Do you even know they only have 46% winrate now, and 44% in KotD5?

Oh wow BBT and dromon gonna go brrr and make them top tier.

You probably don’t believe a single 5% nerf to vil discount brought Hindustanis winrate from No. 1 to No. 20, right?

Cool, what’s your elo?


regarding the vietnamese 100% faster eco research bonus. you are clearly exaggerating, it is really not that big of a deal.