Nerf Mali

Just the title. Poison arrows apply stacking true damage, so they can kill everything including armoured units. They can get up to 1k food and 500 gold (without relics) passive unraidable income… and still get access to stone walls even though they are a “light raiding civ”. Unraidable gold early game because it’s passive income from their unique building. Unraidable food because it comes from garrisoned cows. Cheap, spammable units (including lower cost knights that have higher armour than regular knights). And culverins to make sure you don’t counter archers with mangonels

At least the English farms you can raid, the HRE relics you can deny, and the Chinese you can pressure early. But what the hell do you do against Mali??? Just accept your fate?

Btw, the current Janissary is kinda useless. I literally preffer going English without Network of Castles over Janissaries.


I agree and disagree. Mali need a little nerf that’s true. But their knights have less armor then regular ones. English can wall too so you it’s the same thing with raiding. I think in feudal is a window you have to pressure Mali. When he is about to go 2nd tc and trying to get his cows he need to invest lots of wood and gold to his eco. So he wouldn’t have resources to get fast army.

The passiv gold I don’t think it’s insane because in late game it doesn’t that much.

I also could raid his gold pits in early game because he have to invest a lot wood around his pit and can’t defend that spot in early game.

But he have to see. In the pup I only played VS ottomans and other Mali, so I don’t know how other civs do VS Mali.

Ottoman in case need a buff I guess. Maybe they are good late game, but they don’t survive that long.

Only thing mali needs is to have their javelin throwers moved to age3, firstly because it makes their archers in age 2 completely useless, and because javelin throwers+donzos composition have no direct counter in age2.
Their eco is fine. You can probably even do damage ny sieging their houses around the pit and even the pit itself with scouts since goldmines are usually out of tc range.


What is unraidable? The landmark that gives cows extra food? The landmark works in tandem with the cows; u can raid the ranches; no ranches= no food from landmark?

And where’s the 500 gold coming from?

jans are pretty op vs cavalry, including camels and elephants

I know he mentioned Jans in his opening post but if u comment on jans you’ll bring the hoard of Jan haters (and promoters) over to this thread to takeover!

But yes Jans in perfect setup is one of the best anti cav in the game; the problem is getting that ideal setup since they both are countered by all range damage AND take bonus dmg FROM horseman :frowning:

Their pit mine and houses have very little health and get torched pretty quickly. Same with the ranches.

Actually if you can kill a ranch and at least on of the cows in it they can’t rebuild the ranch there because of the corpse.

The discount achieved by the castle age burgave like landmark (FARIMBA GARRISON) does NOT achieve a discount of even 400 gold/min in imperial WITH blacksmith upgrade making constant batches of Musofadi gunners.

farimba’s cost for 5 gunners is 960 gold. The time it takes to batch with blacksmith upgrade is 39s (52s without bsm). Being you’re saving 20% per unit and the standard unit price for the gunner is 240 resources, that’s 48 resources saved by 5 equals 240 gold saved per batch of gunners. 240g_discount/39s = 369g_discount/minute. Mind you it’s a discount which means you only repeat the benefits IFF you have the initial resources to spend in the first place.

Similary with the Cows landmark, it only gives you extra food IFFFF you already have the cattle in the first place; so while the landmarks are NOT ez to break the sources of their bonus ARE easier to attack (gold mine/houses and cows).