@DoctBaghi @JokerPenguin593 @JonOli12
I promised a computation on how to maintain the exact water balance by reducing the dock tech discount and increasing the age up discount.
Since Italians are our “defense” vs the old viking mirror island match, the computation ensures that the amount of resources italians spare remains constant.
So:
- apply the exact build order you do with the current balance in a standard island match
- you will be able to afford all the techs in the exact moment you currently do
- you will see at the beginning of the castle fight and at the beginning of the imp fight the same amount of resources of the current balance in your stockpile
This is to say that I agree with @DoctBaghi and @JonOli12 that Italians should not be nerfed on water if Viking do not. Here some options
let me precise that Italians, in the current patch, save
- 765 resources from feudal + castle + dock tech (applied to castle age techs) discounts from feudal to castle
- 1850 resources from imp discount + dock tech discount (applied to imp tech excluding cannon galleons and elite cannon galleons)
The goal is to make these number constants.
I have excluded cannons since:
- they are not a research with important priority, so they are always postponed, while the other techs are researched by Italians as the hit the age
- Italians have condos as game ending options, so it is a minor issue if the cannon galleons are a bit less viable. Clearly a specific discount for this could be implemented if you really want to maintain also this, but I do not see this an important or difficult to implement (just say dock discount can be set to X% for all techs but cannon galleon ones, for which it stays at 50%)
Option 1
- Dock teck discount 40%
- age up discount is 20%
then
- Resources saved from feudal discount + castle discount + dock tech (applied to castle age techs): 732 vs current 765
- Resources saved from from imp discount + dock tech discount (applied to imp tech excluding cannon galleons and elite cannon galleons): 1624 vs current 1850
Notice that this balance option is a relevant water nerf for Italians in imp, then it should be discarded. In fact, despite the improvements of land balance, the imp water Italian game is heavily hit. This does not respect the condition of maintaining the water balance untouched we all want (I am with you, @DoctBaghi, and @JonOli12).
Option 2
- Dock teck discount 35/45% in castle/imp
- age up discount is 25%
then
- Resources saved from feudal discount + castle discount + dock tech (applied to castle age techs): 753 vs current 765
- Resources saved from from imp discount + dock tech discount (applied to imp tech excluding cannon galleons and elite cannon galleons): 1872 vs current 1850
Option 3
- Dock teck discount 35/40% in castle/ imp
- age up discount is 20/25/30% for feudal/castle/imp
then
- Resources saved from feudal discount + castle discount + dock tech (applied to castle age techs): 728 vs current 765
- Resources saved from from imp discount + dock tech discount (applied to imp tech excluding cannon galleons and elite cannon galleons): 1804 vs current 1850
As example: to have the exact numbers of the current balance (i.e., 765 and 1850): dock discount to 38.5/41.5% in castle/imp
Option 4
- Dock teck discount 30/40% in castle/ imp
- age up discount is 30%
then
- Resources saved from feudal discount + castle discount + dock tech (applied to castle age techs): 774 vs current 765
- Resources saved from from imp discount + dock tech discount (applied to imp tech excluding cannon galleons and elite cannon galleons): 1804 vs current 1850