New patch

Good changes so far.
I am a bit unsure about the mongol buff. Although they do need buffs to their mid-late game, that initial ger may help them with that but its also a buff to their tower rush which is already strong, even after the tower nerfs.

One thing that brought a smile to my face was seeing the plans for the naval combat rework. I am really looking forward to that one.


Finally they fixed TC behavior. It was so stupid.

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Sadly the nerfing of delhi continues. Tower war elements aren’t that strong even if you back them up with multiple monks. They die easily from archers, cavalry, infantty, siege. Every other unit Counters them. They don’t have a good range and cost a lot, now they don’t even have health anymore. Delhi is the last picked civ for all ranks. And still they continue to nerf it deeper into the ground based on top players feedback.

Nerfing of tower rush will have a detrimental impact on all naked fast castlers like HRE, Mongol, French, China etc. They only way to stop them from reaching Castle in 8-9m was to tower rush them. Now that’s not possible anymore. Delhi is the slowest to reach feudal due to multiple nerfs to its starting wood while Mongol gets 100w and villager time back with a ready to go ger.

I don’t even know now how delhi is supposed to counter anything. By the time their horsemen reach the enemy is already transitioning to Castle. Should we all just make spearmen in the dark age now?


No no no? Tower elephants were never weak? You’re dishonest or misinformed. The only thing that can consistently kill a tower elephant is a keep. Otherwise just 2 scholars can out heal basically any dps that can chase down tower elephants. First off 15 by 2 on a very short attack delay with standard 5 range isn’t weak and only a select few units out range tower elephants. Secondly with their INCREASE in range armor basically arrow will now tickle the creature and you’ll ABSOLUTELY have to engage the unit in melee combat WHICH is the problem since it can run and shoot and receive aid from other units via body blocking to prevent it being surrounded ON TOP OF the uber scholar healing.

Nobody at decent levels JUST makes tower elephants, but always they appear in a composition that offers them much support.

Next issue is feudal aggression got buffed thru the TC garrison and attack nerfs AND the earlier and cheaper ram!! Also a 30 second age 2 technology would zero scholars should only take 105? Sec to research for delhi which means rams pushes are much more viable for delhi too.

Lastly TR did get a well needed nerf…was it over nerfed? Hmmmm, i would rather a 10s increase build time with the 250hp reduction but the strategy isnt destroyed, it just means you need units to pull it off which mongols and english always do so those 2 won’t suffer much from this nerf.


I’d like to see changes to Wheelbarrow, a tech that everyone researches in any context lacks a strategy decision.

People don’t all research it at the same timing.

every ranged unit has more range than tower elephants, yes each and every one of them.

reducing health by almost half and then increasing ranged armor by a few points is a clear nerf. it will die faster from the same archer mass which used to kill it before easily as well.

run at what speed? its slower than every other unit. delhi’s scholars are faster than these elephants. and body block is available to every unit not just elephants.

what feudal aggression are you talking about by the time delhi is able to get even one unit out in feudal rest of the world is transitioning into castle. don’t believe me check any high level game play and show me a case where a delhi player is able to beat a quick HRE fast castle player.

delhi can make max two blacksmiths in early feudal and have around 3 scholars which are usually out trying to capture the sacred sites. and nobody researches siege engineering when they dont even have a single unit out. people will always research iron under-mesh and other techs first.

early tower rush was the only tactic possible against fast castle HRE and early rush from English. It is not a good thing, when people use tower rush as offence they dont care how long it takes or how weak it is. the thing which hurts the most is they can be built right next to your TC.

i would advise you check some delhi gameplay before making these snarky comments
delhi’s only power spike is at 20-24m and everywhere else they are rock bottom

in all of matchups delhi has more chances of loosing than winning, with english they have a 50% chance and slightly better against mongols.

see delhi pick rate below, its rock bottom, you should have seen it a few days ago it was even below mongols.

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5 range is the standard range for most range units. Horse archers, Zhuge nu, mangudai, grenadiers, camel archers ALL have LESS than 5 range? So WTF is you talking about??? You’re being dishonest or COMPLETELY misinformed?

they lost closer to a 3rd of their hp as oppose to closer to a half. And standard castle age crossbow (not including blacksmiths stuff b/c you can cancel it out with your own defensive buffs) shoot for 12 damage every 2.12s? So currently at 860 hp and 4 range resist it would take `108 crossbow volleys to kill 1 elephant; so if you had 30 crossbows it would take 4 group volleys to kill 1 tower elephant. Now lets look at the new math at 600 hp and 7 range resist: you’d need a freaking 120 crossbow volleys to kill the new Tower elephant. I will give you credit in that IFFFF you had 30 crossbows, it would STILL take 4 group volleys to kill the new Tower Elephant. Keep in mind that 3600 resources, 30 pop units taking 4 volleys ( about 9s) to kill a 1000 resource, 3 pop unit… This doesn’t sound efficient? Some how I think Dehli would have 2600 resources to respond to that crossbow mass maybe?

This to me is what tells me you’re more likely just misinformed… all melee units with 1 exception has to stop to strike, so any moving targets takes longer to strike down. And secondly body block is a huuuugge advantage to larger units b/c it easier to body block for them to prevent them being surrounded. So in the scenario you have a unit hitting targets for 30 damage up to 5 tiles away at 1.38s attack intervals while moving away at 0.88 tiles/s AND getting archers or MAA or spears or anything…body blocking to keep melee from surround it AND you have a scholar or 2 healing that unit…I think we’ve seen this scenario enough time to know the Tower Elephant isn’t gonna die easily.

Lastly I notice you posted without the rank interval? Was that on purpose? Because earlier in your post you used the phrase “high level”

So if you want me to check back with you using high level gameplay why did you post an overall matchup statistics??? What I SHOULD have seen are these:

Notice at the Diamond plus “high level” Delhi isn’t don’t so badly, even vs FC HRE they are JUST below 500 at 49.6%??? And we know HRE got 2 nerfs (a bug fix and a nerf).

if you dont select any rank level it shows you the average of all. which is what i posted.
see i dont have to argue anymore because beastyqt, fitzbro, and many more players from all levels have already clearly said that delhi got nerfed badly in this patch. your outrage is unjustified and is hurting delhi player base even more. its pick rate win rate is in the lowest and this nerf isnt going to help it at all.

Finally the rush is viable and feudal has been brought back to life

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look buddy, i am at work right now, and i dont have the time or the patience to fight with you. When i login to the game later at night i’ll post you screenshots from the game proving my point about the range and everything else i said. Delhi has been nerfed badly and it will have a negative impact on its already rock bottom pick rate and win rate across all ranks. I am not going to argue with you anymore on this so lets just keep our sanity and stop with the incessant name-calling and screaming alright!


TR is gonna be dead in water now. Too many nerfs to it to make it good strategy to be used. Idm them changing / nerffing them but losing 250HP + 15 second construction time and less effective DPS. All of these affect also defensive outposts which isn’t good. Outposts early on as defensive did very little against armored unit and now they do even less. Even tho I hate outposts buffing rams and nerffing outposts is just too much in one go.

Well what can be expected from the developers that are constantly removing strategies from the game.

Same with healing nerf from monks. If the issue was delhi scholars then do targetted nerf and not nerf to every civ not that I really care about this but it looks stupid to nerf it for everyone

Don’t forget they also nerfed the town center. So RIP early defence.

I wander how anoying early aggresion will be.

RIP early ez boom vs early aggresion.

I love aggressive play that start in dark age. Scout harrass TR bbq spearman villager fights, even french knight harrass( hate playing against it!!! But love the concept). It’s all efforts to keep the game honest and strategic.

IMO no opener should be inherently safe. So the less garrison room in the main TC means when heavy units run by your main you’ll have to have other means of pulling your villagers to safety. I like this!! People are not realizing this but all these defensive merfs are DIRECT nerf to the most aggressive designed civ in game… the MONGOLS!!! EARLY HORSEMAN rush will be meta especially TC and towers are weaker and ppl will NOT standardize opening darl age barracks. Also unguarded defensive towers will burn!!! More free bounty

please, explain to us how the tower elephant has less range than zhuge nu, mangudai, horse archer, camel archer, grenadier :slight_smile:

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They nerffed but made it easier to use with auto target, but im still worried they did too many nerfs on single thing. Like outposts. While I hardly use them in early or mid game still it just makes my own job easier with lancer rush. don’t need to worry about them anymore as much just can over run them so easily now

TR for china is still slive snd well AND the cheaper rams and weaker defenses and the cheap and fast spear upgrades all marry together well!!! I steam rolled a french player on altai, diamond 1 player. You’ll notice the increase however chinese build so fast that IMO it doesnt matter!!!

I predict tower rush china will climb to 3rd win rate given all the buffs to aggression!!

Honestly, after playing a few games in the new patch i really loved what the devs did.
At least in my opinion i feel there is now a good balance between attacking and deffender advantage, i have played in both positions
Rams are now viable, they are much easier to make now which means you can easily punish someone who is going too greedy. However the auto targeting makes so deffending becames so much easier as i can focus all my attention in microing other things.


Landmark Outposts bugs remained(?), but thankfully a good patch