New Tatar TC Sheep Bonus

How good is this economy bonus?

I think it seems fairly good. You basically get free food, without having to waste wood on farms. Making a town center gives 2 sheep with 2 hundred food, but factor in the Herdables contain +50% food, so really it’s 300 food. Well, the sheep will decay but still that’s a nice bonus.

Does your starting town center spawn sheep upon reaching the feudal age?

Because it’s a finite bonus, I think it’ll end up being more of an indirect military buff by allowing Tatars to comfortably afford both economy upgrades and military in the early Feudal and early Castle Ages. This fits well with their current bonuses giving them an early, but finite spike in almost every Age.

It is not an immediate food spike, you still need to collect it. It is more like a wood saving bonus

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I don’t think it’s that great, no matter how exactly it will work in the end.
you still need villager time to get it and after Feudal Age it might even be annoying to have to spend some time shift clicking vills to get the food. It probably helps the most for M@A rush (expecting the TC to spawn 2 sheep once you hit Feudal Age), where you are very happy if you can delay making farms. Gives them a very solid options to follow it up with very fast archers and still have a good eco.

On the other hand I also think Tatars were quite underrated and I never understood their low winrate. So I’m happy they didn’t get a huge buff. That’s why I very much like the change.

Silk Armor got buffed now providing +1/+1 armor instead of +1PA, which is another deserved buff and their Hussars will reach 4 MA, their Steppe Lancer 4MA and the HCAs 6MA, which a nice change and @DoctBaghi disgareed with that lol

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Hmmm, I didn’t think about very fast Archers. Their current wood savings gives them a very fast Scouts build by training the first 3 - 5 Scouts from 3 Stables. The extra wood savings from the new TC sheep bonus might also give Tatars something similar for M@A > Archers. Or just straight Archers. Would be cool if it is so. It would also mean having a similar early spike in Castle with Crossbow or Cavalry Archers from reaching Castle Age with 3 Archery Ranges.

Yeah, but I’d also see that in the category of a smaller buff to give them some love, nothing major - and I like that as well. Steppe lancers will still be useless (unless they get buffed in another way), but for Hussar vs Hussar it’s really nice. For HCA it probably doesn’t even matter that much as well, but it’s just another tiny boost to a unit, which is already quite strong for them.
So Tatars seem to be very fun throughout the game to me. I’ll probably play them quite a bit if the opponent doesn’t want random mirror :smiley:

Wtf? xD
I could understand 2 Stables - might actually be interesting to try. But 3 seems way too much, as you won’t need that at all until mid Castle Age (except for the first round of Scouts). Then rather manage your ressources in a way to click up a vill earlier and safe that 175 wood of the 3rd stable - should give you the same number of Scouts at the same time.

It should - though here again - not 3 ranges. Usually you follow up M@A with only 1 range if you rush it. Tatars will be able to do that for sure, maybe even 2 ranges, but I’m a bit sceptical about that. You also need a Blacksmith.
It’s not that you can’t build 3 ranges, but more that you won’t make good use of them and then rather would have spent those ressources on 3 farms to click Castle Age a bit faster.

Also, it is easeir to defend 6 villagers under a TC than 6 dispersed among farms, unless the enemy uses onagers…

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A small clarification: 2 sheep is only about 250 food due to decay. If sheep spawn in Feudal, that’s an amazing overall bonus for any map. If it only works for new TCs, it’s a bit niche and only matters for FC builds. Maybe there will be no farm FC or something wacky like that.

I think it does. If it were for new TCs only, it would have probably been “starting in Castle age”.

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The boost to silk MA is also something that parthnan asked for at some point

I can’t remember the exact numbers(I’ve posted em before) but it’s something like everything of 2HS melee damage level or lower takes longer to kill a tatar hussar. Anything doing more damage is unaffected vs hussars.

Whereas CA is safer vs every melee

It really depends what you’re doing with your vils. Instead of working on berries or wood (for example) those vils could be eating sheep at a higher rate than berries… While the normal number of vils are on farms… Meaning it is free or faster food

I mean in feudal isn’t sheep eating faster than farming even…?

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Yeah but past a certain number of vills under tc gathering froom sheep they get less efficient that’s why you use berries in the first place.

Farms are a bit faster.

Thank you for the spoiler, I was trying to avoid them until the patch was actually released…

However, for what it’s worth, just because they implemented something that I was against it, it’s perfectly fine, maybe it’ll me right, maybe it’ll prove me wrong, in any case it’s not like I own the game…

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Yeah probably a good idea and for all we know these things might not be implemented. So we could be discussing something that never happens.

This accounts the villager time required to gather the wood price? (This would be interesting for the long term, whereas if you need food already I agree farms are faster)

No, it merely accounts for how much is gathered with a given resource averaged over a fixed period of time. The base line difference is farmers collect 2 food more per minute which of course increases after wheelbarrow and heavy plow (not sure by how much, though).

Yes, also this is an incomplete patch, I know that some civs aren’t present, so they may have changed or not, but more importantly even on those that have changed, we don’t have the complete picture.

I mean, they could have given them an amazing bonus, but at the same time removed some units or tech from the tech tree, so it’s difficult to really know how the meta will change.

Last but not least, there is still time, we don’t know exactly when the patch will be released, and it could be still subjected to changes in the meantime.

I want to avoid as much as I can to bias myself until I get the real deal… then I’ll happily discuss all the changes.

It is the worst buff between all civs that got buff. It is completely a big joke and trash and useless. My big hope is the CA fixing, if they just fixed the CA it will be good more than any buff, i was hoping like give the Tatars bonus about the CA like it is training 30%-50% faster or something like that or have more hp, because actually 2 more sheeps in feudal and so on is useless, especially the gathering rate on sheeps is slower than farms, so if your enemy is already on farms his food income will be better than you

Before wheelbarrow, if you consider the wood price of the farm, the food income is better. You can take that one villager from wood and put in sheep to get faster food income.

Also, this bonus allows tatar to delay farms even more so they benefit from the horse collar upgrade whith their first farm. This is also a wood bonus.

I expect a SotL video considering all or these issues


Sheep nothing the civ D: Is it too hard to think of the problems tatars have and then give them something that promotes the attractivity to be played and their identity without copy pastaing existing bonuses ? More longer lasting sheep how about that ?

Spawning something when you built something sounds more like coming from a card game than anything else where you just invent new bonuses to sell more new op cardpacks. Or FE devs just spent too much with the card game in the AoE world called AoE3. Where are these sheep coming from ? Are they being born by the villagers building the tc and using its birth station before any villager can use it for villager creation ? Tatars just need something to overshadow the hill bonus thingy which totally dominates their identity. And hinders you of picking them on a map where you are not certain to have crucial hill on the map… As if pros now pick tatars more often, because they think that yes more sheep that is what i needed the sheep and hill civ, that makes them really moist.