The only thing left to make this game actually good is a complete reworking of the impossibly complex scenario editor we are left with. If the devs want the average user to make any decent custom scenarios, they need an ingame editor as seen in mythology or aoe3. Back in the hayday of myth and aoe3, custom scenarios reigned supreme. It is simply inexcusable that they released such a terrible editor. I am confident they have enough programming skill to create an in game editor that functions with the same simplicity as in prior age games.
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Itâs not terrible. It is complex, though, youâre absolutely right.
The tools of older games are more simple because the games are less complex.
Iâm definitely hoping they continue to improve it, but youâre comparing a 2005 game to a 2022 game.
In the meantime, the devs have been massively adding to the documentation. I recommend going through it, as complex as it can be.
5 Likes
Different engine, different tools.
The Content Editor we have now is basically the exact same tools actual developers use to create stuff in the game.
If you ever worked on modding/mapping for Company of Heroes 1, Company of Heroes 2, Dawn of War 2, this is basically the same stuff.
Now, it would be a great idea for Relic to release more advanced tools, actual technical documentation on how stuff works in-game and extra tools we currently have no access to, but they are absolutely not going to make an entirely separate development tools just for âeasierâ mapping. Thatâs absurd.
This is a complicated 3D engine with a lot more advanced stuff baked into it compared to the days of AoE2 and AoE3. Game development is hard and requires programming/3D/math knowledge, who knew, eh?
7 Likes
Needs to be made more user friendly and theres no point if you have the best game editor in the world if its to hard for most people to use.
The modding section in game needs to be updated to find the good maps and modes easier.
You shouldnt be able to upload a mod or map without a pic and proper description
A good editor you should be able to make any game with it like the starcraft 2 editor
5 Likes
Iâm 100% sure it will be made better and more user friendly. But thereâs only so much the Devs can work on with the time they have
We received some really good balance updates and 2 free civs, thatâs already more than other games received within a year of release, which is a good sign for the future ahead
2 Likes
welp the mod tools complex issue is real as this anon confirm what i said before in other threads.
Nope. Thereâs a barrier to entry. It exists. But thatâs expected because the game itself is complex.
The developers have been writing tons of documentation - Iâve linked it. Theyâre putting the effort in. They want people to use the tools. Theyâve talked about improvements they want to make.
And somehow I doubt youâd use them regardless 
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What do you want?
A super complex editor like SC2 that letâs you change everything but you have to go though like 5 things to just change the damage of a unit.
Or a simple editor like AoE2 where you can quickly make a scenario but only have limited triggers.
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I would rather you spend time to read and learn the more complex editor than have devs spend time away from perfecting and expanding multiplayer.
Devs need to keep making new civs/maps/ai pathing and bug fixes etc!
The editor is quite powerful.
I do think they should make it more user friendly though. Also, would like to see things like UI mods.
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this, the fact that UI mods ainât doable properly rn is mad
yup there ton of tutorial and material from the devs but still the bar is too high for the average mod entusiast which didnt happened before
also certain kinds of mods, example UI, being impossible to do properly due to editorâs restrictions, ranked play filter for UI modding would solve this, so custom UI layouts/reskins donât include cheat software, just my thought
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itâs 2022. this game was in development for like 4 years. I am confident they have the capability to making SOME kind of UI changes and other fixes to overhaul the editor in a way that is user friendly for most people. I understand its a new engine but I refuse to believe that this is the best ui they can come up with for this editor.
Show me a single new custom scenario other than castle blood. You wonât because the editor is too complicated and no one is making any decent maps.
1 Like
The fact that the engine is available to anyone with the game is a wonderful thing in of itself. As others have mentioned the devs at relic are constantly adding more documentation directly in the script files, the ScarDoc database, and the workshop walkthroughs right here on the official website. It was originally designed for CoH games, which operate on the same concepts but converting the nuances between the ever-so-slightly different implementations of functions is no small task. GUI changes in naming and definitions are many and all of this requires insane amounts of troubleshooting. Many hands make light work, and two heads are better than one. Thus, as you may notice, the program is currently in Beta.
With approximately zero experience with scripting nor 3d modeling I was able to put together âHoly Deltaâ a crafted map mod and âMegafaunaâ a tuning pack mod, each within a few hours of free time over a weekend. Now a couple months on and a few of those weekends spent tinkering Iâve compiled a functioning Game mode âNew Photon GMâ published under the ign âTheChrontonicleâ, expanding on standard win conditions and options incorporating a functional regicide objective where the a.i does not send their king to certain death in battle while still allowing landmark, religious, and wonder wins, as well as adding the option to use the fabled Photon Man(or Photon Mans, if you desire) in combat.
Imagine what you could make if you were open to learning while contributing to a completed premier release.
ScarDocs api / html has lot of that detailed stuff not (yet) explained in the workshops, or that are mentioned or used in examples but confusing to utilize
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Iâm a modder , I really agree , my problem about CE is that there are still not a dark mod sadge
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Because same problem was in CoH. and they do not care to find the solution.
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Iâm sure you could tell us what it is, if itâs such a simple, straightforward, cost-effective and easy thing to do?
Powerful functionality requires powerful tools. Ease of entry / onboarding is definitely something for the devs to look into, but at the end of the day itâs still going to be complex, and to do advanced things in it is always going to require a level of proficiency.
Who ask âpowerfulâ functionality. People here saying about âcomplexityâ of the game. They say âcomplexity requires powerful toolsâ.
But problems:
- for test-run you need to restart the game (either devs do not share test-game for testing⊠orâŠ)
- people want simple solution for limited number of tasks.
I do not see any differencs with aoe2-scenarios. Same concept: map + script + fast restart to test staff. (in aoe2 there is âtest-scenarioâ for testing). [doubt it exist in aoe4]
btw, about complexity https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9ZMobR31qdE&ab_channel=T-West
They just do not care.
PS Site were simple in 1999 and become complex in 2022, but there are site construction from fucking blocks, so itâs easier to construct site in 2022 than to programm it in 1999.
you just need to work with it.
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The Devs have perfect sample for UI in AoE2 scenario editor, or even AoE1
They need to try to recreate it, focus to make as more 'user friedly" (easy to handle) as possible ,
I think, majority want to create own scenarios and campaigns + simple & effective tool for it, not complex mods
3 Likes