These guys are just stupid. Are they beatable in a fight with proper armies like pure Lancer/Cannon? Yes, but their insane speed and siege+them not being vulnerable to cav means they can just waltz into your base and kill everything. With this speed, skirm don’t beat them either, because they can close the gap so easily. Oh and did I forget to mention they’re only 238 coin? Even with the increased infantry cost card at the church for more speed.
5 Likes
They did nerf them before also upped their pop but reverted the pop back to 2 so they are broken again. Such a stupid unit.
7 Likes
Just need a nice 0.5x vs light infantry and they should be fine.
3 Likes
Si fuera una unidad azteca ya le habrían bajado la armadura dos veces, penalización contra guerrilleros, RoF más lento y las culverins con bonus contra ellos.
En fin…
6 Likes
They’re not too bad as long as you can keep them out of range, but with that speed it’s not going to happen. Nerfing their base speed to 3.5 would do a lot to curb their strength.
It was nerfed with 3 pop, and then people complained it was shit, and now its strong again.
and the cycle continues
5 Likes
Ive said it before but these just should not do aoe damage on their regular attacks. Theyd be fine even with their old stats then imo
3 Likes
Mercenaries shouldnt be that pop effective, specially for civs that can train them massively from several buildings
1 Like
Yes I agree, the 3 pop solved all of our problems but we keep going on the cycle
Eh, they were a bit weak late-game then; I think the real fix is part of what Opdepov said and part making them three pop.
This unit is a merc version of the soldado so I don’t know why they don’t just make it that. I don’t even understand thematically why they have this area-ranged attack, are their bullets just that big or something?
2 Likes
Yeah, that always struck me as a bit odd. I mean abstractly it could be seen as them using ‘Swan-shot’ (i.e. cannister shot for muskets), but it’s somewhat tenuous. Anyway, if it’s the Merc version of the Soldado, surely it should not have AoE ranged.
I agree with the pop - it should be back to 3.
3 Likes
w8 a giant gimmick of the soldado is that it has aoe damage in the lategame due to them being grenade trooper.
we can just reduce the base aoe down to 0.5 and reduce the effect of incindiery grenades to only increase splash by 0.5 like the soldado
as well as making them 3 pop.
otherwise they are worse then highlanders
1 Like
If you just want them removed making them 3 pop will achieve that. Weve seen it before with Landsknecht and the giant gren itself. Making them 3 pop just makes people not use them anymore, its not a good way to nerf Infantry units.
2 Likes
just make the melee attack has a 0.75 bonus versus cavalry and maybe that would be enough. I’ve not watched how well theu go against skirmishers though.
I prefer them to be lesser used instead of be abussed in every single game.
They are the merc version of a 2 pop unit so it makes a lot of sense they costing 3 pop
1 Like
Soldado and Giant grens are both musk variants. They just both have a grenade siege attack and an extra grenade trooper tag.
Perhaps the aoe effect could be moved to their melee attack, making them more of an melee/siege assault unit.
No, they dont:
-
Musketeer (1) → Highlander (2)
-
Soldado (2) → Giant Grenadier
Like these ones that arent variants of pikemen
-
Pikeman (1) → Swiss Pikeman (2)
-
Halberdier (1) → Landsknecht (2)
-
Rodelero (1) → Barbary Corsair (2)
No matter what you think the unit is based on, it still performs like a high siege musk. But unlike the Soldado who only gain an aoe attack through a card. These guys have it on every attack just because.
Even if it were based on the Soldado there is no set in stone rule that every merc should cost more pop than their counterpart. Many of these design rules comes from the community rather than from the devs.
Even so, making them 3 pop would make them immitate their RL battlefield presence. 3 pop infantry will just not be used, and in their current stats theyre probably fine as 2 pop anyway. The problem seems to come from the stacking of movespeed combined with being cheaper than normal and faster trained.
So it seems when it comes to nerfs we probably need to look at Wallenstein’s. Which is ironic for a tech which finally escaped the thrash tier.
Alternatively their unlock could be moved from merc camp to the Potsdam Giants card.
1 Like
Wrong. Doppel → Landsknecht.
1 Like
It’s the same with the 4 pop armored pistoleers. There’s no infantry worth more than 2 pops for the simple fact that they are not mobile enough. There was no unvierse where you’d run 3 pop giant grens (which should not use AoE mainattack) and there is still no universe for 4 pop armored pistoleers.