[Poll] Should other civilizations replace their archaic units?

They are archaic simply because they do not use gunpowder or more modern weapons.


Well, I don’t know if I should revive this topic but I would like to open the discussion again.

There are many civilizations that have replaced archaic units with more modern units, such as the German and Portuguese crossbowmen replaced by units with firearms.

Now recently I realize that the Russians have received a carabinieri who is efficient against general cavalry. You can convert all your horse archer shipments into dragons.

Could the Ottomans receive similar treatment in the future? I know that many will be against it because the Ottomans have been spoiled a lot lately, but I would like to see some kind of gunpowder cavalry for the Ottomans, even if it is limited to just shipments.

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Mounted Nizam

In the original game, Archaic units couldn’t be upgraded past Veteran except for the ones that were Royal Guards to your civ. I miss that, it felt realistic.

Anyways, yes, I think archaic units should stay in the past and be upgradable to more modern units in the later ages.

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I would say yes to this proposal
But delivered as later ages cards like British Rangers and German Landwers

That would be great, but what would differentiate them from the musketeers?

The Longbowmen continued to be used until the start of the English Civil War (1642-1651); therefore they fit into the timeframe of the game…

Longbows remained in use until around the 16th century, when advances in firearms made gunpowder weapons a significant factor in warfare and such units as arquebusiers and grenadiers began appearing. Despite this, the English Crown made numerous efforts to continue to promote archery practice by banning other sports and fining people for not possessing bows.[66] Indeed, just before the English Civil War, a pamphlet by William Neade entitled The Double-Armed Man advocated that soldiers be trained in both the longbow and pike; although this advice was disregarded by other writers of the day, who accepted that firearms had supplanted the role of archery.[67]

At the Battle of Flodden in 1513, wind and rain may have contributed to the ineffectiveness of the English archers against the Scottish nobles in full armour who formed the front rank of their advance, but when the opportunity arose to shoot at less well protected foot soldiers, the result was devastating. Despite his armour, King James IV of Scotland received several arrow wounds in the fighting, one of which may have caused his death. Flodden was the last major British battle in which the longbow played a significant part, even if not a decisive one.[68] Longbows remained the main weapon of the trained bands, the home-defence militia of the Tudor period, until they were disbanded by Queen Elizabeth I in 1598.[69] The last recorded use of bows in an English battle may have been a skirmish at Bridgnorth, in October 1642, during the English Civil War, when an impromptu town militia, armed with bows, proved effective against un-armoured musketeers.[70] Longbowmen remained a feature of the Royalist Army, but were not used by the Roundheads.

Longbows have been in continuous production and use for sport and for hunting to the present day, but since 1642 they have been a minority interest, and very few have had the high draw weights of the medieval weapons. Other differences include the use of a stiffened non-bending centre section, rather than a continuous bend.

Serious military interest in the longbow faded after the seventeenth century but occasionally schemes to resurrect its military use were proposed. Benjamin Franklin was a proponent in the 1770s; the Honourable Artillery Company had an archer company between 1784 and 1794, and a man named Richard Mason wrote a book proposing the arming of militia with pike and longbow in 1798.[71] Donald Featherstone also records a Lt. Col. Richard Lee of 44th Foot advocated the military use of the longbow in 1792.[72] Winston Churchill, in A History of the English-Speaking Peoples, wrote:

The War Office has among its records a treatise written during the peace after Waterloo by a general officer of long experience in the Napoleonic wars recommending that muskets should be discarded in favour of the long-bow on account of its superior accuracy, rapid discharge, and effective range.[73]

There is a record of the use of the longbow in action as late as WWII, when Jack Churchill is credited with a longbow kill in France in 1940.[74] The weapon was certainly considered for use by Commandos during the war but it is not known whether it was used in action.

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Depende de que consideran “arcaico”. Los piqueros y alabarderos se siguieron utilizando hasta principios del siglo 18, los ballesteros y arqueros fueron reemplazados a mediados del siglo 16 por las armas de fuego.

Yo creo que todas estas discusiones no tienen sentido hasta que los desarrolladores dejen claro en que época se sitúa cada edad del juego. Yo diría que cada edad fueran 70 años empezando en el 1500. Edad del comercio 1570 a 1640, edad de las fortalezas 1640 a 1710, edad industrial 1710 a 1790, edad imperial 1790 a 1860.

Si hacen algo así y dejan claro las épocas de las edades cada vez que agreguen una unidad nueva sabrán en que edad ponerla, no van a poner gatling en el año 1640.

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las picas y alabardas pueden quedarse como infanteria cuerpo a cuerpo porque de lo contrario solo se podria pelear con bayonetas y seria aburrido , las ballestas si necesitan ser reemplazadas con cartas de la metropoli

Yo creo que son 100 años por edad:

  1. Edad de la Exploración (1420-1520)

  2. Edad del Comercio (1520-1620)

  3. Edad de las Fortalezas (1620-1720)

  4. Edad Industrial (1720-1820)

  5. Edad Imperial (1820-1920)

Pienso que queda mejor asi
desde el siglo 16 hasta la segunda mitad del siglo 19

1492 and 1876 AD There aren’t many things in the game outside of that range. It is absurd to say that it extends until the 20th century or that it begins before the discovery of America.

These were really interesting, though more of an experimental sort of unit, though they were used in the English Civil War and a few other wars so a minor degree. The pikes themselves were a combination weapon with a Longbow attached to them.

If the Italians can get a tank that was never constructed, I’d love to see an incredibly niche experimental unit (but real!)of Double-armed Men.

…but as the for topic in mind, these are not really a replacement - rather a novel unit that actually wants to push the archaic into early modern :grin:

A lot of people here are talking about, does “x or y civ need this”, but my thought process is “would adding this be fun and historical, without breaking the game”. For example-
Adding something to the Russian church card that enables you to train St. Peterburg dragoons instead of cav archers. Say we make this an age 5 tech; at that point would being able to build them be better than being able to build cav archers? I’d say no, at least not stat wise. But would it be fun? I’d say yes, they look awesome and make for fun “role play”, as historically Russia used a lot of dragoons in their army.

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And now he has one of the best dragons in the game.

I mean, they’re not very accessible, and they can’t even get imp.