Ranked Matchmaking for Deathmatch Games is Not Good!

Hi there,

Can this awful, restricted and unbalanced map pool for DM be changed please?

We need a proper version of Green Arabia or Blue Arabia to be part of the map pool. Otherwise, give us the option to only choose Arabia for DM games.

The other way is, either increase the number of bannable maps or remove the crappy maps such as Black Forest, Mediterranean, Arena, Nomad, Golden Pit, Hideout, MegaRandom?! and Alpine Lakes from DM - that’s literally every single one of them except Arabia!

Most of us DMers hate these stupid RM maps! These are not even made for or optimised for DM… It is such a disadvantage when half of your side of the map is not even designed properly to build buildings upon for a fast-paced DM match…

You also need to let us view the ELO ratings and the opponent we are up against, before we commit to starting the game, this blind matchmaking is ridiculous! And the fact that once you click “Find Match” then we can’t choose to decline accepting the game is beyond me?!

Why are we forced to click “I’m Ready!” and then be forced to play the game once a blind player has been found? There needs to be another option of Leave Lobby, upon seeing the ELO rating and the opponent we are up against.

The reason why I’m saying the above is because the ELO balance is not good. I am sometimes losing many games in a row - quite badly because of exceptionally good players repeatedly versing me… Sure, they are only gaining a few points upon the win, but how is it fair to play against someone who is so much better than you - over and over again?!

It’s the same opponents repeatedly playing against me, whenever I am queuing up in matchmaking.

Sort this out please!

You need a system similar to that of Voobly or the old MSN Gaming Zone. Not this copied approach to games like CS:GO when it comes to matchmaking. They are completely different games!

This is particularly frustrating when you are wanting to play 1v1 or 2v2 DM games.

I’m sorry for the rant but I can see why many of us DMers have gone back to playing on Voobly because of all these reasons given above.

The changes might be good for RMers, but you need to consider the optimal settings to get balanced DM games for DMers too and the kinds of maps we usually play.

If the maps were balanced, I would say fair enough, but the other maps besides Arabia are not optimised for playing competitive DM.

Please change the things above and listen to the community!

Otherwise, the DM community will slowly die out and just be left with those persistent players who are noob-bashing beginners or intermediates, very similar to what has happened in Age of Empires II: HD Edition.


  • NiNjA.

wth, no arabia for death match? thats garbage system if thats the case.

Don’t reply with useless and unhelpful comments like this. Maybe you don’t, but there are loads of us who only play matchmaking, it’s all about the “competitive” multiplayer experience. This is what I’ve paid for, so I expect it to be the best for a game designed by Microsoft! Third party clients such as Voobly do a 10x better job.

Even with their Spring update, they have not listened to the community once again. Now, they’ve added even more crazy RM maps to the DM pool as well, which we have been voicing that it needs to be separate or let us choose the maps we want to play at least by not having this stupid limited ban rule!


The issue for DM is that it is a very small community. Look at the number of aoe2.com. The number of players is just very small. This makes games sometimes one sided. The same will happen at Voobly or HD. You have pretty much two option: No game or some non balanced games.

I do agree the map pool is pretty weird for DM. I do think this must be changed. I made a thread some days ago to suggest maps for the current map pool. I hope that the devs will have a look at it. One of the statements i made was to add a seperate map pool for DM.

(Suggestions for new maps for map pool next month)

Note: I dont really play DM, so i cant really suggest good maps for DM.

I play DM quite often. Currently my 1v1 DM elo amounts to 1469, which means I’m in top 100.

DM is a game mod that has been played out pretty much only on Arabia before DE.
Despite that, well - personally I do like hybrid maps like Golden Swamp.
For DM settings I only dislike the idea of middle gold on this map, which always forces players to add ships in order to control middle gold area. It’s not that bad since players get a lot of starting gold around them. Yet again eventually players need to get water.

DM is all about quick decision making, understanding units and counters, map control, map awareness, speed.
Civs are Mirrored in DM so Mirror should be a default setting for the civ (as Random civ is for RM)

Therefore DM maps should be open,
allow players to quickly drop buildings around their starting TC,
NO nomad start,
no single point concentrated resources,
should give access for land units to access all players without having to always cross water.

For example Arena is a not a good map, because it gives players preparation to build only siege or UUs and it comes down to who has better siege.

No Hill Fort cause it’s awkward to place buildings in the beginning. In addition palisade wall allows players to go straight for UU without any risks.

No Gold Rush cause it has extremely concentrated gold in the middle which allows players to fortify it with castles, towers and quickly exhaust enemy from their starting gold.

No Islands cause it’s just the matter of winning water and there’s no other way than having superior civilization with better ships like Vikings or Koreans (thanks to their unique ships and no counters).

Obviously no nomad.

DM should have its own map pack just like “1v1”, “Team” have and “Empire Wars” would if it ever gets implemented as its own Game Mod.

Best Regards,


And the DM community is so small because of these matchmaking issues so everyone just went back to voobly and AOE HD… :confused:

1 Like

The forced map pool and bad maps it contains are also a disaster for RM. On top of that forcing players vs civ pickers.

The map pool can perfectly be opt in without the need for bans, that way everyone can focus on his favorite maps and not be bothered by ones they dislike. If needed, seperate ladders for open, closed and hybrid maps can please the average elo argument.

This limited MM system is the product of a lack of imagination or understanding of the communities needs. Squeezing a large and varied community through such a system is simply naive and unacceptable.

The big pro for DE over HD or Voobly is the map pool for me. So i dont know why the system is simple naive and unacceptable at all. Only thing you really can say it the map pool itself. It is kinda bad. They need to solve that. The map pool needs to reflect the needs of the players. This means distinct map pools for 1v1 and team games and even different map pools between RM and DM.

Civ picking is a good thing.

The map pool being FORCED is bad, not the idea of a map pool. This is why it should be opt in (no bans). I clearly explained it in my post… It’s very naive to think such a limited system can please a varied community, It has caused so much friction. Not even a fully featured ranked lobby to make up for it, what they did is a disaster nothing less.

@ReigeOctavius Did I say civ picking is bad? Being FORCED to play civ pickers is bad. If 2 players agree on settings, there is no problem and the game can start. If they differ then a timer starts and the random player should be able to [Start game] or [Skip opponent]. If the timer runs out the game starts.

Everyone can choose their own preference, but no one is forced into disliked and unfair settings.

You forgot one important thing. You are not forced to play with the map pool at all! Previous versions of the game, like HD or at Voobly, had only the lobby system. DE has also the lobby system. If you like that system, then why not use that system to get into games? It is available. So just please go to the lobby.

The match making system is just a second system. It is a second way to get into a game. It is really not the only one. No one forced you to use this system at all. I like that system. It is just so much more easy to get into a good game compare to the system at HD of Voobly. So i use this. If you dont like it, no one forced you to use this. Just use the lobby, like you was used to play at HD or Voobly. There is really no one who say to you that you have to play using match making.

Are you unable to understand what I’m saying? Don’t you understand the difference between a random or forced vs opt in map pool? I have no problem with the concept of a MM system or map pool. The current system is just a very limiting design choice and it doesn’t have to be like that. Players should have controll over what maps they play, because not everyone has the same preferences.

I even mention in the post that the lobby is currently not an alternative since it does not have it’s own ladder to rank from there.

A fully featured ranked lobby should exist for it’s own reasons (mainly for niche maps), however MM should be setup so it can be the main system where player identity is respected and you aren’t constantly demotivated by having to play disliked maps.

The match making system is just a second system.


No one forced you to use this system at all.

If you want to respond, please read carefully and try to understand what I’m saying. The 3 posts above are totally besides what I’m saying.

1 Like

Honestly they should just make an Arabia only que for RM (preferably random mirror here) and for DM

Dude stop it, think. Why would only arabia players have the privellege to play their favorite maps? And why should they be seperated from the rest of the players?

Why not an opt in map pool that allows everyone to play whatever they want within the pool?

It’s so bizarre how everyone is suggesting their own limited solution instead of the obvious fix that can please everyone. Some are endlessly arguing over maps, others are even suggesting seperate pools for closed, open and hybrid maps. This just splits the community to get the same effect as an opt in map pool that keeps everyone together. (controll over maps) The only thing that (if needed) could be split into open, closed and hybrid are the elo ladders. I really cannot understand it. Is the concept confusing or something?

Good point.
If you pair that with an option for “random mirror”, which makes every game a random mirror, as long as all players have it enabled/ticked/whatever, everyone should be happy.

Thank you, please spread the message.

Do you enjoy random mirror specifically, or is that your way of dealing with the current situation of being forced vs civ pickers? It sounds like a strange fix, because it’s not effective at achieving controll over what you want. Let me tell you my solution;

What’s important is that both players agree on the settings. Both can pick civ or random, when they have the same setting there is no problem and the game can start. However when they differ, an unfair situation can occur for the random player. A timer starts and the random player gets the chance to [Start game] or [Skip opponent]. If the timer runs out, the game starts without his decision.

This relies on the premise that random should be encouraged over civ pick because it keeps the game from becoming stale, and helps to create well rounded players. It’s bad to discourage those who are playing out of their comfort zone for the greater good.

But also it’s important to give players the chance to pick civ, as longs as they find an opponent that agrees. This is how it has always been with traditional lobbies. The factor that makes this work is that usually likeminded players are in the same elo bracket, so lower elo will be happy to both pick while higher elo will more likely enjoy to go random.

Combining an opt in map pool along with this mechanic would make a flexible system that allows the freedom and controll of a lobby while having the MM benefit of being automated.

(Mirror should be an option amongst civs, however it should bypass this mechanic because it does not create unfair situations)

Based on these kind of post i get the feeling you think everyone need to agree with your solution and every other solution is bad. So i would include your solution also into the ‘their own limited solution’. It are your own words: Bizarre that everyone just suggests their own limited solutions. It even feels like you dont want to listen to feedback on your own solution. See also the quotes in this post. It is not really fruitful to start a discussion about your suggestion, if you just get this kind of responds back.

To respond to the opt in idea. I dont think it is great:

  1. We have seen how this system functioned at Voobly and HD. It will results in players only playing one specific map or playing imbalanced match ups. The rating system will tries to fix this but playing multiple maps. Yes, it can still be improved, but i feel it is already better than the system at Voobly or HD. I do think having a bit more control about the maps you play is nice, but i dont believe in a opt in system. I much rather prefer some ‘mark as favorite’ system, where you will be playing on these maps much more frequently.
  2. It is great for the game if it encourage to explore new stuff in the game. Exploring all possiblities and all different kind of strategies will be encouraged by having to play different maps. It will greatly increase your knowledges from the game. I also think it will be more fun than just playing over and over again. One of the blessings of DE is not having to play the same map over and over again.
  3. It all stand and fails by the maps in the map pool. Some maps are great and played frequently. Other maps are terrible. This is an issue the devs needs to report. This can be easily done by just replacing the 3 maps that are banned the most or are played the least. Maps like MegaRandom and Bog Island will than just disappear next week. Hopefully we can get something good back. I already posted a link to the thread with my input at how to make a great map pool and what kind of maps are best suited to me for the map pool. Have a look at it.
  4. I dont understand why players still whine about the match making algorithm if they also can play unranked games. If the match making system is so terrible as they say, what holds them back to play unranked games? You can pick the settings you want and you can play whoever you want. Just like it was at Voobly or HD. You know you also have unranked elo, but it is only not shown? So if you really care about the unranked elo, you just can have a look at aoe2.net.

You know you already can go mirror. So if you want to play mirrors only, it is possible. If both players go mirror, then it already select a random civ. The same for both players.

If you call my suggestion limited then you simply do not understand the meaning of the word. This system respects most wishes to a reasonable degree (unless you expect others to play with you on settings they don’t enjoy).

It cannot be compared to a traditional lobby because 1) A map pool presents maps to you, this promotes variety. 2) Selecting more maps will reduce queue times, this further encourages variety instead of forcing it. 3) MM takes away the abillity to pick opponents, this reduces smurfing and increases elo accuracy.

Your comparison is based on the assumption that the two are the same.

It is great for the game if it encourage to explore new stuff in the game.

Encourage yes, force no.

It all stand and fails by the maps in the map pool. Some maps are great and played frequently. Other maps are terrible.

How can anyone still think that a magic map pool exists that will please everyone? Come on. Let’s keep working on the map pool, but realise that everyone is different so we can’t push everyone through the same cookiecutter.

if you really care about the unranked elo, you just can have a look at aoe2.net.

Let’s stay critical ok… The lobby should be fully featured, a downgrade is not acceptable for a definitive editon. However the lobby should have a totally different function, eg; to play maps outside of the MM system or casual games amongst friends.

Please, don’t bring down my suggestion because you want to impose your own preferences. I have listened to all the arguments over the months and some of them are reasonable and some not so much. This system can keep everyone happy and together.

Most other opinions are limited to adjusting the map pool to someones specific preference, splitting up the community into multiple map pools or banishing unhappy players to the lobby. We can do much better.

That doesn’t solve the problem at all, because the main selling point of random mirror is getting fun and unique matchups. Mirror actually does the opposite of that.
The reason you want both players to be random is not to have every single match as fair as possible (which mirror would achieve), but to guarantee that while playing those fun matchups you sometimes get the better civ and sometimes get the worse civ - so it’s fair in the long run.

I think it’s pretty likely that most random mirror fans would still prefer civ picking over playing mirror.