Remove it at multiplayer. Easy
But isn’t that Warcraft 3?
Moba is just Warcraft 3 without the base building and armies.
Literally. Dota was originally an WC3 custom map and it used all the WC3 hero mechanics.
I don’t think that is the way to go for RTS. I think Moba and RTS being different genres is a good thing.
I agree with your points but I don’t like that conclusion.
Also I hate the word MOBA. Multiplayer Online Battle Arena applies to like 90% of multiplayer games. Aren’t Call of Duty, Fortnite and Street Fighter also Multiplayer Online Battle Arenas?
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It doesn’t kill any strategy ? If it killed raiding then we could talk, but now you are repeating same trash argument as everyone else who hates on it, without any substance.
Goal of raiding is to disrupt opponent and slow him down. You are still slowing him down by idling his eco, killing his eco… Stopping villager production is not even consistent or a goal at all, you can’t interact with it. Aggressor always has advantage against the defender. (map control, idling enemy eco, guaranteeing safety of his eco). All pressure is put on the defender…
Ironically you could say that aggressor with AQ is much more efficient as he does not need to requeue units, so in reality raiding is even better with AQ…
If objective of raiding was to idle TC, then you would have to be able to somehow stop or dequeue units from enemy TCs… but you can’t do this. Objective of raiding is to gain advantage over enemy and that is definitely not lost by AQ…
So if you really want to push the anti auto-queue narrative, come up with a really good argument that is not completely stupid and you can actually defend it. And saying that players have to learn how to click more is not good argument. Saying that raiding with AQ is ineffective is wrong…
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Isn’t that one of the biggest reasons why Dawn of War III failed? It was “universally” criticized because of it. It tried so hard to make it play like a MOBA / RTS game.
if AoMR becomes a Moba-fest game, I’m sure it’s going to be doomed to failure.
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I may not have explained myself well. I’m simply saying that RTS should have some MOBA-like element to be more accessible and I say this for team games. In DoW III it was done all at once for all modes and then didn’t get the support it should have and failed because of other things as well.
A lot of people who made this criticism never played DoW II, which was even more of a MOBA, and successful regardless.
The problem with DoW is that vDoW was a lot “more” classically RTS, so DoW III was stuck trying to please both fanbases, when the previous games were very different. It also didn’t get the pre-release engagement with fans that AoE IV and hopefully Retold will get (though with different studios, they will have different plans for pre-release access).
A lot of people got stuck on “MOBA” because there’s a lot of elitism in RTS and folks tend to look down on MOBA games, in my opinion.
There is one big thing that RTS can provide that “MOBA” can’t really provide.
Casual game modes and single player.
MOBA is inherently competitive while it’s only one aspect of RTS.
How many people bought Starcraft 2 because of the campaign or the coop? Probably a lot.
AoE even more so. People often throw around number like 50% of people only buy for campaigns, but I think the reality is more complex.
People like RTS because you can have nice campaigns, competitive multiplayer, coop with friends and funny custom map game modes.
So RTS should not try to compete with MOBA, a game that focuses on pretty much just one thing, RTS should embrace the diversity of content it can offer.
I think there should be more official content like Castle Blood. Something that is fun and different.
The developers have better tools to make such content since the AoE/AoM editor is not as powerful as the Starcraft 2 one, so the developers can do a lot more then the community alone can.
But all the tools, features and units they add for those modes will be more tools in the hand of the community to make more content!
DotA 2 has repeatedly come up with (radically) different game modes from the core competitive game. Nothing is impossible.
I don’t think RTS as a genre should compete with MOBA as a genre either, but I don’t think that’s what Adribird was suggesting. They just want RTS to not stay exactly the same thing forever, because literally no other genre does. Taking things that have proven successful elsewhere and adapting them to fit is how every single thing improves over time.
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I’ll ask again how does someone else using autoQ affecting you in any way? If you want to play without it and to be competitive you can be that as it doesn’t force you to use autoQ. The way I’ve understood it is that it’ll be on by default at launch but it can be turned off for those who prefer to play without it.
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You have the same view as I do, but try to moderate with the expression “stupid argument”.
Regarding the MOBA elements thing, I never suggested competing with that genre, but bringing out the good stuff for the competitive aspect.
If I play against a player and I do a well timed attack, lack of autoQ would mean their attention would be more divided, leading to more damage, and also idling time of TC, so even more damage. Opponent having easier time to react to actions leads to different outcome…
But at the end of the day a player who doesn’t play with autoQ will be more effective overall which is all that matters so you will have the edge over someone who has it enabled. For example look at the interview over at Creative Director Adam Isgreen talks Age of Mythology: Retold and the Victors and Vanquished DLC for Age of Empires II: Definitive Edition | Windows Central
Adam Isgreen specifically says the following and I quote:
“And so as we look at features like this, you know? I mentioned Villager Priority, but I don’t know if you’re aware of Villager Priority isn’t as efficient as a player doing all of this stuff, right? There’s (sic) delays and there’s (sic) things that we’ve intentionally put in that the game is still really great and easy to play, but a real player can be more efficient if they micro everything.”
Then he goes on saying:
“…But yeah, we’ll look at options, you know. Again, this is one of those things. We’ll listen to the community and see what they really want. But what we really want to do is just open the games up to more players. And we know that not everyone has the mind to be able to micro as much as others and that, you know, they can enjoy the game this way.”
“…And I think as people get over the initial kind of like, ‘Oh my gosh, this stuff is in PC now, what the heck?,’ I think they’ll see that, ‘oh, this is actually not this big of a deal as I thought it would be.’”
Me reading this feel like they understand the players concerns that are against this idea and they will of course on top of that listen to our feedback if it turns out to be different than what he is saying in this interview. And I agree with him, a player that have full control will always be more efficient over a player that uses the autoQ feature.
AQ is one of main function in Original AOM, because some people doesn’t like this function then it should be removed for them? Without even a good reason?
Just go to make another AOM2 for no AQ function by themselves.
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To be fair, it was only added in The Titans. The base game didn’t have AQ.
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Yeah but how many things did the base game for AoE2 not have that are considered absolutely essential today?
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Please don’t remove auto-queue, it’s amazing!
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It shouldn’t be removed. I hate idea of removing things that a game I love had.
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AQ was the best qol addition from the titans expansion. removing it would be a sacrilege.
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I Agree !!! No More AutoQ, please Microsoft.
I disagree as a long-time player, and this is certainly not the only reason for why it might not be a contender as an e-sport. I think it should be in the game or at the very LEAST be a game option, heck you can even ban it from ranked games if it helps the competitive community thrive more. For me, AoM has always been a fun casual game even when I try my hardest in a standard match.
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