Revolutions NEED Spies

Dear Devs,

Last sunday i played a game as Spain and after my revolt the other player just hid one vil and forced me to look for it for a whoopin 15 mins.

It stands to reason that endgame techs like Blockade, Spies, and the Knighthood/peerage are available even to revolutions.
I even propose to have eco boosts like sustainable agriculture etc. (even though nerfed), but i know that it is improbable.

However, the remaining are essential techs and that serve an endgame purpose, since sometimes due to rules, its impossible to go Trade monopoly.

Many thanks


Also revolutions should also allow you to imperial your royal guards.


But then what would be the drawback?

  1. Lost economy
  2. Your other units (especially artillery) will not get imperial level, and most of the time you will not be using the royal guard anyway
  3. No access to imperial age economy.
  4. Trash water (depends on maps)
  5. You don’t have immigrants, so you will produce units slower.

Most revolutions at the moment aren’t viable, getting imperial royal guard will give them a helping hand.
Alternatively allow revolutions to spam their unique unit (not all of them can do that!), instead of getting them from towers/forts/etc.


Oh, my bad, you were just talking about royal guard units, not all. Yes, I see this as viable


The Revolution system is a mistake, it should just be removed entirely.

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No, it is not a mistake, it just need further adjustments. People are using revolutions more often now, so this is not a mistake.


It’s just not fun cutting of your oen leg, by permsntelty losing the chance for imp techs just for some short term power spike.

Would rather see revolt somehow changed so that they are no major long term downgrade and somewhat competitive with imp.

How about allow imperial age to be reseaeched after revolting, but all imperial age techs cost double. You still have the changed deck with can be good or bad as an offset, still lose eco unless SA.

Or revolts can directly research imp techs but the capitol stays unbuildable, so imp units but no imp eco techs.

Anyway currently ist just too high risk that you can’t close out the game by revolting and then permsntelty hamper yourself which is just not fun in my opinion

Honestly if revolt was meta and not imperial age, wouldn’t that be actually quite fun?


No. When I want to play British, I want to play British in the Imperial Age, not be forced into a Revolution.

Revolutions need to be Competitive with Imperial.

And Tupac Revolution and Meiji Restoration should be revolution techs too imo (in a world where Revolutions can actually compete with Imperial age).


The problem with giving revolution civs spies is that couldn’t someone can cheese it by rushing to Revolution and rushing spies potentially? I suppose the best answer to this is to maybe give revolution civs some kind of ‘buddha’ tech that reveals everyone for only a short duration, but even that could broken.

The idea of revolution civs getting their royal guard units able to be imperialized sounds decent, but I still think the most fitting buff is simply giving each revolution civ 2 Revolutionary(Colonial Militia) combat cards. One for Revolutionary attack, and the other for Revolutionary hp. This gives revolutions some better scaling while also ensuring that the revolted player’s Revolutionaries don’t just dominate everything on the field immediately, keep in mind shipments are a HUGE resource for revolted civs so requiring 2 to boost their Revolutionaries seems like the best bet in giving them some longevity.

You understand the concept of going revolutionary right? Its a choice between Age V or revolution. Literaly all Age V has is upgrades and capitol. This post is advocating to basically make revolutions have the best of Age V. Thats not how it works.

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No. Read again until you understand.

Spies still cost a lot of gold. You would need a LOT of gold and slinging to get to revolution early, and a LOT of gold to get spies. It would be unviable at best.

Most revolution revolve around one or two units that are imperial level (Peruvian Guard, Nizam Fuzilier, Independence Guards, Death Hussars, Mounted granaderos). And i like that.

I think what should be created is more cards/upgrades for those specific types.

Exactly. For example, Egypt is completely unviable right now, as you LOSE all of your vills and all of your Ottoman main bonus to be able to train mams or Nizams? ITs just not worth it.

Egyptian Settlers should not convert to revolutionaries or if they convert, the ottoman bonus should not end after sending citizens.

This thread aims at giving spies and other minor techs to revolution. If you can introduce some more mechanics to revolt… better. Imperial is costly and gives 50% more to everything so it will always be better.

Revolution are already competitive with imperial age.

In 99.9% percent of the time, nobody ever go to the imperial age in 1vs1 supremacy. People revolts way more often than they go the imperial age.

I’d like revolution to be reworked obviously, as anyone else. I believe that, when revolting you should :
1/- Keep your deck
2/- Still be able to go imperial for 4000 food/gold (and you can revolt imperial)
3/- Have a one time bonus
4/- Add something like 5 unique cards in your deck (similarily to what the american state mechanisms do, this mechanism should have been implemented in all civs, it’s a very innovative way to link the old politician from AoM with the homecity mechanism from AoE3.
5/- Revolting should be renamed, so that, in some cases, there is still a continuity with the previous nation (e.g. Canada is more a natural evolution of british colonies in North America rather than people revolting and breaking the ties with the british)


agreed, I suggested this as well in my posts here: Improving AOE3 - Age of Empires III: DE / III - Discussion - Age of Empires Forum

best way would be to move spies to the industrial age, so you no longer need to get to imperial to close out won games. having spies not show building foundations will allow you to see units that are hiding easier as well.

The problem is, most revolutions cannot freely train those units. For example, Romania can’t train their special cavalry archer and dragoon, they are forced to spam towers and send shipments, this makes their unique unit kind of worthless.

To the same extent, it happens with Egypt. Revolutions should always be able to train their special unit, this will make them be viable and go toe to toe with imperial age.

True, but in team games and treaties, revolutions are not very really viable, unless they are South Africa.


Spies is not a minor tech it can mean winning or losing. Knighthood is a minor tech.