Rework? Condottieri

For the lack of a better word, I have written rework, but it isn’t too major.

Current condos: Negate max 10 anti-infantry attack bonus from gunpowder units.

Now, you see the bonus has two conditions both of which have to be satisfied. In The Forgotten, the Condottiero straight up negated 10 anti-infantry attack bonus from all sources, so its speciality used to shine. Currently the bonus negates 10 attack bonus from HC, and 1 attack bonus from every projectile of Organ Guns.

Proposal: Condottieri negate 10 attack from all gunpowder units, like Shotel Warriors with Heirs do against all mounted units.

Change: the most common matchup Condo vs HC is unaffected since both of them negate the exact same amount. In addition, Condos work well against Janissaries and Hussite Wagons, survive against Conquistadors much better, and straight up murder Organ Guns and Bombard Cannons (though it is insignificant for BBC to hit Condos). I maybe forgetting some gunpowder UUs. The change against BBT will be negligible since reducing 121 attack to 111 is eh.


They need a significant rework in relation to Goth spam. Hera made a few videos about it now and more people will try Goth Sling strat in team games.

They need to add Elite version of Condo. Make it so that people don’t have access to Elite Condo until the Italian player researches Condo upgrade.

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TBH Imo Condos are fine.
Their special utility doens’t add much to italians as italians usually don’t have much issues facing enemy gunpowder anyways.
But they at least add a special utiity to the otherwise kinda bland civ.

Imo the unit that needs a rework is actually the GC.

Imo GC shoudl have the same “utilization” stats as the archer line for italians. Possibly even remove the elite upgrade and make them automatically upgraded with the arb upgrade aswell.


Can’t agree more. An elite organ gun now does (9-5)*6=24 damage in one hit to condo, which is absurd.


I feel like that will never happen like the fact that there are still a lot of bonus damages left from the time that Camels used the ship armour class.

I think they should take the risk an clean up those stupid old bonus damages and actually utilise the negative attack bonus for Condottieri.

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This also means there is no need for “Condotterio” armor class, right?

I liked the idea. Not something Italians need, but it will be better design for an absolute anti-gunpowder unit.

No, the new “anti-bonus” damage systems work baiscally the same.
The only difference is, that they don’t use “named” armor classes rather than unnamed new ones, which is silly imo.

I don’t understand ehy they convolute the armor class system this way, as if it wasn’t confusing enough before with eles taking bonus from cavalry also.

Back then without Condottiero armor class, they take no bonus dmg from slinger, Cataphract and jag warrior. There is no infantry unit having ‘true’ resistance against infantry bonus damage.

That would change under my concept for an Oceania expansion. The Micronesian UU, the Kiribati, would basically be an infantry Cataphract.

The problem I have with them is they still get rekted by gun power units regardless the anti infantry bonus. then you have units like Janasaries who don’t have anti infantry bonus so they destroy condottiero anyway.

They should have worked like in the old day when they just straight up resist all anti infantry bonus like cataphract with anti cav bonus. Still even then, they are still a bad investment considered how expensive they are with below average combat capability.

Maybe giving them the elite update with +2 attack and +10hp would solve the problem, or maybe just make them like cataphract on foot, who knows.

Condos got nerf because infantry civ allies can abuse Condo with their own civ bonus/techs. (Malians, Goths etc) Italian Condos ignoring infantry bonus dmg was not a big problem.

IMO remove condos as a teambonus and make them a civ only unit. Goth problem solved. Swap silk road to team bonus (with massive nerfs ofc, maybe something like 10% cheaper or something idk). Give a new UT that does something idk.

Now the condos can be balanced without thinking of other civ bonuses, silk roads isn’t the most useful ut either, and maybe their ut can buff their weaker areas while not making them too strong on closed maps/water maps. Ofc some other small number adjustments

Just remove the discount of Goth is fine. Condottiero is mercenary companies but not trained by Goth themselve