Saracens Need a Buff!

Hey Guy’s, I think the Saracens are due for a buff! Anyone else agree? I feel like they can’t compete with all the newer civs that have been added since HD. I mean they’re an original team, they shouldn’t be struggling with all the newest civs, that’s not fair.

I think a solution that could really help would be to make Mameluke’s more affordable. They’re really too expensive, and hard to mass in 1v1. Why does every other civ get a UU they can afford, but not Saracens? I think that would really help balance the team out because Mameluke’s are really good.

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Saracens are hardly the only ones struggling. Koreans, Turks, Indians (on land) and Portuguese all need help too.

This is a good buff, the Mameluke is in fact very expensive, i could see reducing its gold cost by 10.

all of the elephant unique units would like a word with you.

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Untrue, specially for 1v1. No one masses War Elephants, Ballista Elephants, Elephant Archers, Cataphracts, Boyars and several other UUs that are either brutally expensive, or hard to mass.

Many of those are even harder to mass than the Mamelukes.

Saracens are also a great civ that consistently performs averagely in most maps.

Elite Mameluke is expensive, but incredibly good unique unit, like can be seen from this video

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they literally lose to cataphracts in that video.

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They only lost to war elephants, cataphracts and teutonic knights. Had one draw too. Most of the opponents got overwhelmingly destroyed. Magyar huszars were gone almost before fight started :smiley:

Elite mamelukes having fun in here:

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to be fair the problem with these tests is zero micro is involved. and not surprising they lost to ETK.

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Cataphracts resist anti-Cavalry damage, and the fights are not microed.

It would actually be pretty sad if Mamelukes could take down Cataphracts without micro, since the unique aspect of the Cataphract is having no direct counters.

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the not microed part is the big part that matters. i mean shoot, in theory those mamelukes could beat the TK, you’d just spend an hour microing.

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TKs will have a hard time actually engaging into Mamelukes, while Cataphracts would not.

They lose to TKs because they are ranged Melee, and TKs are Melee sponges.

i know. its why i don’t like tests like that. or like the tests SotL performs. equal resource tests sounds great in theory, but rarely do you get equal resources of units on the field.

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SotL is better. This man does simpler tests for direct face offs, which still has some value of it’s own.

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i wouldn’t say by much. yeah SotL does more in depth tests, but alot of the time they don’t have gameplay practicality

I agree. Mamelukes are strong but expensive, hard to mass and fragile against many units. Even a small buff like increasing the creation speed for camels and mamelukes would help them. Also, the frame delay for mamelukes is too slow.

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Saracens are fine, Mamelukes are hard to buff with zealotry making them very tanky for
a fast ranged unit. And ranked map pool atleast has two maps with lots of gold so its definitely possible to mass them in 1v1.
Saracens are also very versatile with their tech tree; full blacksmith, FU monks, FU archery range (Saracen and Japanese being the only two), Hussars, 170HP camels, champions, siege ram, siege onager and bombard cannon. The only holes are lack of halbs and cavalier/paladin, which is fine because camels and monks negate the need of halbs and unlike Indians, Saracens can still go knights in castle age

The frame delay is buffed for Elite Mameluke in DE (from 5 to 2 by HD measures) which is lower than arbs and mangudai, sure its not zero of the original but its still very good.

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i think the problem with Saracens is they feel generic across the board basically. at least they do to me. i mean i’m not going to be sad if i random into Saracens, but i’m not going to be excited either.

Continuing the discussion from Saracens Need a Buff!:

That’s funny I forgot about the unique elephant units. They’re expensive too, but the Mameluke is still more expensive in gold than any UU. I don’t play as civs who have elephants so I can’t speak for them, I can only speak about the price of the Mameluke which feels too high. If you look at a Ballistic Elephant they cost 100f 80g, that’s 45 more food, and 5 less gold than a Mameluke, for a unit with more than tipple the amount of HP.

I’m not saying to strengthen the Mameluke, I’m saying to make there gold cost cheaper. Its way to high. If that makes them to cheap you can raise there food cost a little.

The Mameluke is more costly in gold than all those units you mentioned. They have the highest gold cost out of any unique unit. Gold often runs out way before food.

How do they do with equal resources? I’m sure not as good