Seriously?

You get attacked. That happen in that kind of game. So you move your vils torward a safe place. But, for some unknown reason, they go in the opposite direction. But the opposite direction is where the attack is.

I understand that pathing is something hard when you just learn to print “hello world”, but, seriously, that’s something that should be fixed long before trying to create new civs. Getting angry when playing because your actions don’t reflect in the game make the game frustrating. And for a casual player, that’s something that make me don’t want spend any money on it.

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Love that this clickbait title talks about something actually serious :rofl:

Seriously this happened to me almost every game as well. The worst thing is that it’s a patch where devs claim they “fixed” pathing (to some extent).

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It is part of the India DLC pathfinding.
They don’t gb to the pathfinding before India DLC, but try to fix.
Maybe it gets fixed, maybe bot.

I would say for someone who is just learning to print “hello world”, the game is pretty good so far…

Why do some think it’s a good idea to be disrespectful to people you want something from?

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For some good time I’ve been bothered by military units going the opposite direction first when you order them to go somewhere. Are villagers now doing that as well?

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Exactly.

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I sawI saw that video just now

I thought it was just me misclicking or something with Vils (also when getting chased by a boar)

That pathing is just a pile of s**t

Like we can MAYBE excuse combat units for some reason or another or units not taking the hypotenuse and following sides of a triangle

But that s**t with the vil… How does that even happen?

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Survivalist right clicks twice (towards TC) and then garrisons. The strange thing is that a flag is put on the TC after his garrison command, as if that is shift queued. But if that was the case, the flag should have a number on it…

Anyway he didn’t misclick at all. It’s just broken.

Don’t think either of these is tolerable. The latter especially, has been the case at least since LotW DLC:

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I don’t want anything from them. The pathing was pretty good at one point but they changed it and now it’s really bad, they could have let it as it was 6 months ago (if I recall correctly). And they want something from me : they want me to buy more.

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Sorry for that, but I was already a worker when the game came out. I bought this game three or four times, already, so when I play it, I hope to, you know, just enjoy myself a bit after a day of work. When I was playing Mario on the NES, I would have trash the game if, sometimes, when I select left, Mario goes right. They sell something, I am right to complain when that something don’t work as expected.

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nice moving the goal post, everyone is upset by pathing in live patch, but that is not what you said, you said that it’s an easy job to fix the pathing and anyone could do it, when it’s not. Everyone is upset with pathing but if you have 0 clue how development works, you should just end your complaint at the “I don’t like the pathing”.

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Criticizing the pathing is perfectly fine and justified. But why is it necessary to express this with contemptuous words towards the developers (first post)?

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Maybe I have some clues about dev. Except I don’t work in game dev, but pathing algos are no stranger to me. And getting it right take some times, true, but not that much time … or there is something in the game that make it impossible to get right, don’t know. But at that point, maybe, open sourcing the game and let people look at it and solve the problem might be a good solution. And in exchange, which I would find perfectly fine, is to provide servers in exchange of a paid subscription.

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There is a community project that tries to create an open source clone of the genie engine. However, (good) pathfinding is still an open issue there. Actually, it seems like they are researching and debating about which algorithm to use since 2015 (altough I must admit that there is not that much activity): New pathfinding and grouping · Issue #366 · SFTtech/openage · GitHub

Btw: Pathfinding in a dynamic environment is already difficult. But making it performant is even more difficult. My feeling is that AOE2 should also run on quite low spec PC’s. Maybe that’s also a bottleneck for the implementation of a good pathfinding?

Offtopic:
What comes to my mind because of my last statement: Suppose a game gets patched that significantly increases the hardware requirement. Is such an approach legal? Can I refund the game if the system requirements have changed after a patch and my PC can therefore no longer run the game performantly?

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I do agree that pathfinding has often been weird, and I have my own guesses (at least, when playing so no actual thinking going into guesses), but it’s something everyone knows and something the devs know as well. You can take your guess into why the devs haven’t fixed it yet, but I’m 100% sure it’s not ‘haha we now have bad pathfinding, let’s keep that in to spite the players!’

In my experience it has mostly been villagers taking questionable routes, especially when it’s a diagonal movement - perhaps the game can’t find the diagonal line and resorts to walking on the sides of the ‘triangle’, not the long side that’d be the diagonal way. Might explain the vill pathing in the clip as well, though I have also noticed that when shift-queuing movements, each flag pauses the movement and has the unit sort of stumble around. Could have also been that.

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got ocds gotta walk along the square lines

I did some test on my own, but I think the best pathfinding is none. The natural way of going from point A to point B is to go in straight line until you find an obstacle and, then, you start your algo to follow the shape of the obstacale… and so on. It would also patch the bug when you click in some the black spot and the units go in the opposite direction because there’s a wall you can’t see. For some game, that kind of path would work, but for AoE2, I think it would be best. And low on resources.

Well, at first this sounds reasonable and pretty simple. Yet, I doubt this simple approach works as good as you think it would. Simply because you have a dynamic environment with multiple moving agents and you don’t do pathfinding just once but every time tick of the game.

Because of this additional sentence: Do I get you right?
Variant 1: You want that the units actually walk directly to the target and only corrects the direction when it hits an obstacle? Thus, in a walled base for example, units walk in the worst case always towards some wall/building and then search for the gate / opening?
Variant 2: First I assumed that you propose that the path finding starts with a straight line, then avoids obstacles and then tries to optimize the trajectory with respect to shortest path. For example, if the obstacle avoidance algorithm produced a path that is shaped like the letter u (which represents only a part of the total path. Assume that the final destination is located somewhere below the letter u). Then the shortest path would be directly from the start point of the letter to the end point of the letter instead of following the letter u (assuming that there are no other obstacles between start and end point).

For areas not within the range of any of your units I’d also always prefere the straight line approach. Alone in order to not gain knowledge about (changed) terrain. Although one can argue here, whether one should not also allow exceptions e.g. for land units when there is an already discovered lake in the middle of the map: If I want to send them to the opposite location of the map. Should they really walk directly to the lake and then start to walk around it or should the algo be smart enough to know that lakes dont change and therefore already find better paths?

Challenge with above mentioned Variant 1:
Another challenge is that the units probably need some memory abouth their own path. Assume a unit hits an obstacle and decides to move in the opposite direction. What happens in the next time tick of the game? The unit walked in the opposite direction, thus, the straight line approach towards it’s actual destination is to turn around and directly walk to the very same obstacle again?

Challenge with above mentioned Variant 2:
Assume a unit within a walled base. The base can only be left by a gate at the north and a gate at the south. The unit gets the command to walk towards some destination north of the base, thus one would probably prefere that the unit leaves the base through north gate. What happens if the gate is currently blocked by other units? Should the unit leave the base through the south gate? What happens in the next time tick of the game? If the north gate is free now, should the unit turn back? What happens if the gate is blocked again some time later?
I guess, in this example I’d always prefere that the unit walks towards the north gate, nevertheless if it is blocked at some point or not. Thus, moving units are obstacles but still have to be treated somehow different than non-movable obstacles.

How to resolve a scenario where two movable units collide? How do you prevent them from wandering back and forth, always getting in each other’s way again and again? Once you have found a suitable algorithm, does it still work satisfactorily when dealing with a large group of agents rather than just two? Once you have found a suitable algorithm that works also for large groups, is it suitable for melee battles? (btw: I don’t know if the latter one is even important. It came to my mind because in this case for each player his units should ideally not block each other but “search” at the same time for collisions with enemy units in order to attack them)


These are just a few problems that come to my mind without thinking about them for long. And this altough I don’t even have theoretical or practical experience with pathfinding in a dynamic environment. When it comes to the actual implementation, I’m sure there will be many more challenges.

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