Should all unit receive veteran upgrades?

Age of Empires III: DE III - Discussion
1

I skim through and compile unit that is trainable in age3, and is considered as age3 unit stat base (ex: Skirmisher, Dragoon, etc) that receive veteran shadowtech, and The list goes like this:

To start, this is Age 3 Unit that DO receive veteran combat +20% upgrade (25% for Elite). These unit when trained in age2 (by French & Portuguese team card) come with base stat, and immediately receive the shadowtech when reaching age3):

LIGHT INFANTRY

  • Skirmisher (Generic Unit)
  • Forest Prowler (Haudenosaunee)
  • Wakina Rifle (Lakota)
  • Sharpshooter (USA)
  • Arquebusier (Chinese)
  • Neftenya (Ethiopian)
  • Urumi Swordsman (Indian)

LIGHT CAVALRY

  • Cavalry Archer (Generic Unit)
  • Yabusame (Japanese)
  • Ruyter (Dutch Unique)
  • Dragoon (Generic Unit)
  • Musket Rider (Haudenosaunee)
  • Carbine Cavalry (USA)
  • Howdah (Indian)
  • Rifle Rider (Lakota)

HEAVY CAVALRY

  • Hakkapelit (Sweden)
  • Cuirassier (French Unique)
  • Iron Flail (Chinese)
  • Meteor Hammer (Chinese)
  • Mahout Lancer (Indian)
  • Oromo Warrior (Ethiopian)
  • Lifidi Knight (Hausa)
  • Papal Lancer (Italian)

INFANTRY

  • Changdao Swordman (Chinese)
  • Bolas Warrior (Inca)
  • Huaraca (Inca)
  • Maceman (Inca)

Next is Age 3 Unit that DOES NOT receive veteran combat +20% upgrade (25% for Elite). These unit receive no combat bonus, some only name change to add veteran. I wonder if their lack of veteran upgade due being faction specific unit, or balance decision during the early game and the Warchief development.

NO STAT BONUS

  • Cassador (Portuguese, when trained in age2 immediately receive -20% combat penalty, penalty removed when reaching age3)
  • Halberdier (Generic Unit)
  • War Wagon (German)
  • Oprichnik (Russian)
  • Lancer (Spanish)
  • Arrow Knight (Aztec)
  • Jaguar Prowler Knight (Aztec)
  • Eagle Runner Knight (Aztec)
  • Siege Elephant (Indian, artillery but also tagged as light cavalry, artillery of course do not have veteran upgrade)

For completion sakes, I also take a look at age4 unit, these unit usually not easily trainable or there is quirk to get them:

Age 4 Unit that receive veteran combat +20% shadow upgrade

  • Skull Knight (Aztec)
  • Tokala Soldier (Lakota)
  • Shogun (Japanese)
  • Bersagliere (Italian)
  • Papal Zouave (Italian)

Age 4 Unit that do not receive veteran combat +20% shadow upgrade

  • Sipahi (Ottoman)
  • Tashunke Prowler (Lakota)

So this founding raise a question, should all age3 and age4 unit receive the Veteran 20% combat bonus (W for Cassador, Lancer, etc.)? Or should the Veteran upgrade not available for those specific unit (L for Cassador, Lancer, etc.)?

Should unit like Halberdier, Cassador, Lancer, Aztec Knight, etc. receive veteran shadowtech?
  • Yes, they should also receive veteran shadowtech
  • No, they should not receive veteran bonus at all
0 voters
2

This was a design decision, These are units that have higher base stats in certain categories in exchange for not having the Vet shadow tech.

The benefits of this is that since these are base stats, their scaling is higher from any techs that affect them and therefore they gain more benefits from upgrades.

For example, take the cassador.

Their base attack in age 3 is 18

for the skirmisher their base atk is 15 but has a vet shadow tech their age 3 atk is also 18

However, the moment there is an attack upgrade is sent, the scaling comes in.

So a 15% atk upgrade would increase the Cassador by 0.15*18 = 2.7 atk

For the skirmisher it would be 0.15*15 = 2.25

So the cassador gains more atk from upgrades compared to skirmisher.

This scaling is also why for example they had to change the French Cuirassier, which also used to have a age 3 base stats with no shadow tech, it scaled so much better from upgrades that it was nerfed by giving it a shadow tech and reducing their stats

So if you are just giving it a vet shadow tech no change, then that is just a massive buff to these units cause they were designed to not receive them

Now if you are talking recalibrating their stats and then giving them the shadow tech then maybe.

For example, it might be a good idea to reduce the power of the Sipahi by making it a base age 2 unit to reduce their scaling

Artillery are also an example where just about everything is base age 3 and onward (except for the flying crow since they can be availble in age 2)

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