Spicing up the HRE (part 2)

Hi everyone,

this is an updated post of my previously suggested addition to the HRE. It now contains a picture of UI and an example of a building model.

In this post, I would first (in short!) summarize the historical background of my suggestions and after that explain how that could look like in-game.

Like all of you I am in love with Age of Empires IV and also very interested in the actual history part of the middle ages.
In the past I was enjoying playing HRE a lot, but like many of you I get the sense of something missing in the concept of the civ. Often times we hear people say that HRE in particular are feeling one-dimensional. Though there are some nuances, I would generally agree on that statement.

In the past couple of weeks I learned a lot about the HRE history and at the same time I was thinking about how the specialties of this time and this kind of “empire” can be translated into an intriguing game mechanic.
In short summary I would like to share with you that almost from the beginning of the HRE, Kings were elected by the so called “Kurfürsten”, mighty rulers of their territories. They formed an electoral college, which also consisted of the most important Archbishops of the empire. They elected the next King, who could only become King for a high cost of giving away privileges to the Empire (especially to the territories of the Kurfürsten themselves). In many cases the King was crowned Emperor by the Pope.

The KurfĂĽrsten additionally each had their specific role/duty under the King/Emperor. You could compare it to todays ministeries. Some had military duties, some concerning the Church, some concerning ruling the country and managing the wealth.

Additionally in the flourishing time of the HRE we had a very(!) powerful trading union, the Hanseatic League. In short: they were very successful traders throughout all of Europe.

So, after this introduction, here are my ideas of spicing up HRE, bring new unique units and refreshing gameplay into the civ. Additionally, further below, I suggest minor tweaks, so that HRE don’t become busted after these suggestions.

Addition of “Kurfürsten”, english: Prince Electors or latin: Princeps Elector.
In Imperial Age the “Kurfürsten” are able to elect a new Emperor.

Addition of a new building:
College of Electors / KurfĂĽrstensitz:

Available in Age II. 200 wood 100 stone.

Each column available in Age II / III / IV. Fourth column is the Emperor-Choice. Each Element represents a Favor for the house in question.
This is how the UI could look like:

You may only activate 6 different Favors per game.
I don’t have better skills in this kind of stuff, but just so you can imagine it better. It still took some time to do it.

Kingdom of Saxony (top row):

Age II:

Train the Arch-Marshall (200 food 150 gold, 35 seconds): powerful cavalry unit. Passive Aura: +5% movement speed for infantry units in 4 tile radius. Automatically gets stronger with age-up.

Age III:

Technology “Gewalthaufen” (250 food 250 gold): when 12 or more Spearmen are controlled in a Control Group they gain the Gewalthaufen buff, giving them +3 damage +10% HP.

Age IV:

Holy Duty: kill 50 enemy units. When done so, the Arch-Marshall-aura also increases Infantry HP by +5%. Count starts after activating age II and Age III favors.

Margraviate of Brandenburg (middle row):

Age II:

Technology “Hanseatic Trading” (200 wood 200 gold): Traders and Trading Ships produce 10% faster. Traders move 10% faster, Trading Ships 15% faster.

Age III:

Train the Arch-Treasurer (150 food 150 wood 150 gold): not a unit but gives different bonusses:

Traders randomly bring back additional ressources equivalent of 15% of the gold value (can also be additional gold).
Villagers produce 15% faster from non-landmark TCs.

Age IV:

Holy Duty: have at least 100 villagers or 20 traders on the map. When done so, unit production becomes 10% cheaper. Count starts after activating age II and Age III favors.

Kingdom of Burgundy (bottom row):

Age II:

Technology „Theocracy“ (150 food 150 gold, 25 seconds): TCs produce Prelates 20% faster.

Age III:

Holy Duty: secure at least 2 Relics and hold a Sacred Site for at least 5 minutes. When done so, Sacred Sites also each generate 50 Food, Wood and Stone per Minute. Count starts after researching „Theocracy“.

Age IV:

Train the Arch-Bishop (350 gold).
The Arch-Bishop is a sturdier Prelate. Emits the „Magnificence Aura“ (5 tiles): all Prelates affected by it (including the Arch-Bishop): + 15% healing rate, +2 range for heal and inspire. Inspiration duration +10 seconds.

When all Techs and Duties of one Kingdom/House are completed (one complete row), you can elect the Emperor of that House. Only one Emperor can be active. When the College of Electors gets destroyed, you lose all privileges and have to elect a new Emperor. Election takes 120 seconds, costs 500 food 500 gold. Upon completion:

For Kingdom of Saxony:
Units have +10% attack speed. Siege workshops work 10% faster.

For Margraviate of Brandenburg:
Keeps, Towers and Walls are 15% cheaper. Traders trade 15% additional random ressources.

For Kingdom of Burgundy:
Relics and Sacred Sites generate +50% ressources. One additional Relic arrives at your main TC.

Additionally to accompany these changes, I suggest the following.

  • Villagers carry +30% more resources (down from 40%).
  • inspired Villagers gather +30% faster for 30 seconds (down from 40%).
  • Meinwerk Palace: reasearch cost -50% (up from 40%), researches 50% faster (up from 40%).

With this HREs Economy becomes slightly slower in Dark and Feudal Age, further slowing it down by having to build the College of Electors and their technologies (if they so choose to). On the other hand they are given additional fighting power in Feudal Age by buffing Meinwerk and giving them access to a knight unit. They also gain more variation and aren’t narrowed down to focus on collecting relics alone.

What do you think?

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These changes would make the HRE more dynamic to play. Giving them access to more options I also like the early economy nerfs they feel to strong in that area.
Question about the Kingdom of Burgundy will the Relic disappear if the KurfĂĽrstensitz gets destroyed?
If the Relic stays after the destruction of the KurfĂĽrstensitz will another Relic appear if the Kingdom of Burgundy gets crowned again?

If the building gets destroyed, you only lose the Emperor bonus. All made choices beforehand stay active. When the building is repaired and you crown Kingdom of Burgundy again, you gain another Relic.

This is an interesting question though. As I was thinking about the answer, I was also contemplating that this system could work without a building. Instead it could use a system similar to the Ottoman Visir Points UI. With that, you dont need to implement a new building and you dont have to answer what happens, when the building gets destroyed. All the made choices stay active for the rest of the game.

This UI element would get activated in Age II though. Before its grayed out.

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The College of Electors could also be instead hosted in a landmark for a small fee the hosting landmark can be changed at any time. For example once the Feudal Age is reached choosing to Host the College of Electors at the Aachan Chapel 300 food 150g 20s. If someone goes up to the imperial age with Elzbach Palace they can choose to host the college of electors there instead for the same price. This would also work with the Town Center, but it would put the player a villager behind.
Correct me if i’m wrong the College of Electors was not set at one place I think it hosted in multiple different cities across the empire

I think it would be important to make such a system, that it’s as simple as possible. I can’t imagine right now, how it could look like hosting at different landmarks for it to work with more than one UI. I just don’t have the same image of it as you probably, so you may want to describe it further.

Regarding the place of election. Actually I don’t know for certain, I couldn’t find a source for it. The crowning itself was always held in the city of Aachen (later in Frankfurt). But I don’t know, if they held an election there.

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To be honest, if they could have considered a lotta opinions like these earlier, they wouldn’t have made a boring OotD.

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There have been suggestions for 2 years. They simply do not want to give HRE or OotD anything remotely good.

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The Delhi Sultanate keep has 2 UI after village fortress the hotkey to use the second UI hotkeys is y. A few other buildings have 2 UI

I find it strange that the HRE MAA use 2h mace when fully uppgraded. 2h maces are definetly NOT a european weapon and was NOT used anywhere in europe.

Why not remove 2h uppgrade and heavy mace alltogether. Make all european MAA with veteran upgrade automatic gain 2h weapon with slight reach increase like a halberd or smth.

Give HRE poleaxe uppgrade wich give them +3/+6 to heavy. Poleaxe was used alot in the HRE kingdoms and would give them a better european identity then 2h maces.

It feels like the developers give the asian and middleeastern civs all the cool technology but as usual in movies tv shows and many games, european technology is realy misunderstood and/or lack of knowledge

European plate armour is still not a technology used in this game wich i find strange. Composite bows and poison arrows for the exotic and cool civs but as usual european civs are so dull in comparison.

Almost every civ has a unique ranged unit, HRE does not have one. HRE has no unique siege or unique siege upgrades. I think we should start there.

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