before DE, castle age samurai, berserks, karambit used to trade cost effectively with longswords and shotel and woad raiders used to trade about evenly with them. now that supplies is there, longswords completely trash all of these units in terms of cost effectiveness and that’s despite longswords not seeing a lot of competetive use. my suggestion would be having supplies apply to infantry unique units as well or give infantry unique units a different buff. i guess samurai, jaguars, woad raiders, teutonic knights, kamayuks still fill their roles and do their job with their bonus damage/movement speed/armor/range, but i see litte to no reason to make castle age berserks, shotels or especially karambits if longswords are so much more for less as the game stands right now
well you shouldn’t use castle age berserks and woads anyway, they’re mediocre statwise until Elite. And like you said, the roles that some of these UUs like karambits and shotels fill just can’t be filled by longswords. Cost effectiveness isn’t everything; longswords would be just target practice for crossbows, cost effectiveness don’t matter then
doesnt that proof that the unit is broken if you literally “shouldnt use them anyway”. to me, every unit should fit a role and have any purpose and berserks and woads in castle age just do nothing.
Well building up castles and massing them isn’t realistic in castle age anyway, some units are supposed to be late game units.
Samurai: Cost 65F/25G instead of 60F/30G and +0.05 speed
Teutonic Knight: Cost 75F/35G instead of 85F/40G and training time reduced to 10 seconds
Condotteiro: +1 pierce armor, affected by Pavise, +4 bonus damage against Eagle Warriors, cost 60F/25G instead of 50F/35G, but Italians lose Champions
Shotel Warrior: Cost 50F/25G instead of 50F/35G
Gbeto: Gbeto has 8 Frame Delay instead of 10, Elite Gbeto has 6 Frame Delay instead of 10
Karambit Warrior: Cost 25F/10G instead of 30F/15G
I’d go the other route with condos; 10 attack instead of pierce armor and 40F/35G.
Same with Shotels, 35F 35G?
and do TKs really need TT buff and gold discount? 70f 40g sounds fair enough.
Karambits are also back to original price, I don’t know how to feel about that
good start, but idk if thats enough. maybe it should just be cheaper food price and same gold price
seems good, maybe a little too much price reduction, its supposed to be an expnesive unit by design right? maybe just increase the hp or pierce armor a little
havent played italians enough to have an opinion on that
completely agree
gbeto are very balanced right now. i wouldnt change them. if you make them too good to micro, they just become much better cavarchers
completely agree
Not everything has to be used every age. Castles are expensive. Most games I don’t see more then one castle in castle age. And castle age is when you’re booming so food is a very valuable resource.
Should we buff elephant unique units while we’re at it? Those aren’t seen in castle age either but you see them in team games quite a bit in imperial
The problem is Teuton Champions overshadow Teutonic Knights.
Shotels are get destroyed by Champions while they cost +15G and what do they have? Mobility. I think that’s not enough
Even pros complain about Gbeto’s Frame Delay
Tks are held back by their speed. Price isn’t the issue. They absolutely destroy most melee units 1v1. The problem is they are so slow archers wreck them.
Spears are rekt even faster than TK. But peeps don’t mind coz they’re cheap. TK are better than spears vs cav. Yet if they were cheaper people would be more ok with the fact that they are hard countered. And even then, they have 100 hp and 2 PA… So they aren’t actually destroyed by archers. I think they just serve a very specific purpose. As you said they annihilate melee units, buildings and rams…
There would be something seriously wrong if shotels weren’t rekt by champs, they have crazy good raiding potential, seen a number of TCs go down to a shotel blob. But agree they need a cost reduction.
So because teutons have some of the best champs in the game, that justifies making TK better? Huh?
There is no point making Teutonic knight because their Champs are very strong vs Eagles and Teuton Halbs destroy Cavalry
I forgot that Teutonic Knights counter Celts and Slavs
And the problem is tk are slow. They wouldn’t get wrecked as bad if thry were faster. But frankly everything has to have a weakness. Speed is it for the tk
Except they can be out microed.
Siege unit defense against melee units. They out perform almost every unit in the game at it.
Destroy is a big word. Champs barely win, they’ve 18 attack, created fast and mobility is pretty huge factor for infantry. And I don’t know why we have to compare every infantry to champs aside of the obvious ones
You can’t mass Teutonic Knights + Ironclad + Siege in 1v1
I’ve seen today Champions destroyed Shotels in Imp in ClownCup3
You don’t need a mass of them though to defend your siege units.
Well I’d need to watch that considering that’s rather small context
You shouldn’t be fighting shotels into champs anyway. Shotels are high attack high mobility low defense units. Raid with them
Well if you don’t mass them u can’t protect their siege. Hussar can snipe them cost effectively