Teutons are NOT underpowered

[wolfsilver9640]

@Green4uu

I hope their presence in a FINALS of Empire Wars shows that this civ is not weak. It is apparently a good civ on open maps, too, since it was picked on Land Madness of all maps.

According to Viper, reasoning for picking the civ in EW are:

So viper pick teutons one time on 1 games on 1 tournament in empire war on a map where cavalry are very often used and so makes teutons good ?

@Green4uu

Yes the civ “dies to cav archer” (which I don’t believe is necessarily true, you just need to play super defensive, with tons of Castles, TCs and Skirms), but many other civs have bad matchups: Franks are bad into Saracens, Berbers are bad vs Ethiopians/Vikings, and so on.

Addings a “tons” of castles + tc + skirm is not viable at all on any open map and i would even say on any other map for the castle age, that’s just too expensive where the other player can just go on full boom, congratulations your base is safe to cav archer ! Now good luck with any rams or treb push because the opponent is untouch and don’t spend as many ressources as you only for defences purposes.
I don’t see at all why franks are bad vs saracens nor why berbers seems to be so bad vs ethiopians and vikings, this is even probably one of the best civ for castle age vs vikings to handle massed archer and damaging eco the fastest before arbalest timing.

The only way to win vs a cav archer civ as teutons is to win very fast : by doing full feudal or on the first knights before the ca player were able to make a mass of it if you don’t you will be in great trouble.

[FurtherLime7936]

@wolfsilver9640

Too many bonuses which are not interesting and uu which was used to be very situational but since the added armor on infantry and supplies now tk are just completly useless.

As for arena, they are fine but they aren’t for open map.

Well, they may have a lot of bonuses, but still Teutons feel like a much better civ than even Spanish, Goths, Burmese, Incas.
Regarding the UU, yes is very limited and un-practical currently, but their melee armor and attack is unmatched with other infantry, if you force fights, TKs domain. Also you can’t buff the UU to be more usable, because you end with what happened to the Leitis shortly after buff.
As for the civ, is hard to buff them on arabia as you probably need to rework the civ form 0.

[HealFortress]

Arguably the monks +healing range is a wonderful bonus, and there are many situations where it may see use and be successful.

[wolfsilver9640]

@FurtherLime7936

Well, they may have a lot of bonuses, but still Teutons feel like a much better civ than even Spanish, Goths, Burmese, Incas.

Incas are fine if team bonus is improved that’s juste the only issue with it. As for the others, sure they need some changes especially for goths but why teutons don’t need to be changed because of that ?

@FurtherLime7936

Also you can’t buff the UU to be more usable, because you end with what happened to the Leitis shortly after buff.

To being to strong ? You will need a huge buff only to make them at least viable, especially if this bonus of armor continue to exist on champion which already have the role that tk have but in a less specialised way, that’s also the reason why jaguar warrior do not work.
if tk’s role continue to be like that, bonus of armor need to go, champion and tk are redudant but champion are clearly better.

[Coranhon1]

They lack husbandry and not Bloodlines. They are perfectly fine now and balanced

[Pulikesi25]

what’s the purpose of this post. Ya Teutons are awesome on some maps like Arena/Hideout, usable on some maps to counter other melee civs, weak on maps where archer civs are preferred. Overall a nice balanced civ. Could have some buff or modification for teutonic knight but other than that a fine civ.