They have gone overboard with the nerf to the mangonel

They could have nerfed the unpack speed/minimum range/friendly fire/HP or the radius of effect, but I think you just crippled the unit going down from 1.25 to 0.75 and that’s not good for the game. It is true that the meta will improve, but also the variety must be important.


Perhaps they should add of technology to increase the damage radius of the unit?

Or simply make the reload time much slower on siege to nerd them.


We have to wait a bit and watch where meta goes. If you watch the second match Beasty vs Viper in the last round on golden league, there was a boring siege stale. Nobody would attack due to mass sieges, mangos and springs manly… The game end after one hour with wonder Victory.
A change was needed. If mangos become less powerful people don’t need to make tons springs to counter. If the objective is stop age of sieges i think is one step in the right direction. Is the best step? I don’t know yet. Let we see.
For me the best is double the cost of sieges, except for rams.


It does seem like quite an extreme nerf, but I do think they’re right to aim tuning changes at the unit’s damage or its area of effect. Repeated changes to the vulnerability and mobility of siege hasn’t really dealt with how devastating the mangonel was. Making siege ever more of a glass cannon wasn’t the right way to go – a nuke is still a nuke even if it is squishy.


Mangonel nerf is a very good try. Not saying that the radius is a perfect one, but at least Relic has identified the issue and head it to the right direction.

If the nerf is too much, just compensate a little bit with server-side patches. Time will tell the current strength of Mangonels, but It surely will diminish the late game siege spams.

The best patch Relic has even made.


As someone who thinks Mangonels were a big problem in their previous form, I was startled to see how hard the nerf hammer descended here, but I think it’s definitely the right direction and am pleased that relic sees the issue. We’ll see where the meta goes after a while—I expect that this will turn out to be a little too extreme and will be walked back over the long term, but who knows, previous nerfs seemed like they would be enough too and yet always fell short. Really happy with this patch!


These threads are utterly ridiculous… we’ve NOT even seen the perform yet?? Yes the radius got nerfed; let’s SEEE AND KNOW what happens rather than suppose and postulate on how bad it going to be now???

Also… you do know they can un-nerf it right? BAck in the PUP they had the Chinese Imperial Official take 30s to que from the TC… within a week? they reverted the nerf.

Also it’s crazy how every 2nd hour prior to patch was a thread about how OP siege are…they nerf one potentially to the ground and EVERYONE IS UPSET (even before playing it?) lol


A mathematical calculation has been made in this same forum and it was concluded that the Nerf was equivalent to more than 60% of the unit.

My goal when giving feedback is for all units, landmarks, and civilizations to be viable and favor varied strategies.

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Nerfing the damage directly was the wrong decision in my option. If people dont make mangonels now due to being “not worth it” .Then you got other things tasking there place.
So now NOB massing is an option. Now grenadiers is a better option (indirect China buff). Mabe now people will mass just range units because there counter is missing.

In the end I think just a nerf to mangonel health and speed was the better nerf. Seige did need a nerf but this might be a little to much. We shall see how the meta reacts now. Mabe its not that bad after all. Mabe its mass China and range units now.

The original AOE hitbox of the magonel of 4.91 square tiles is LARGER than the footprint of a KEEP (a keep is a 4 tiles X 4 tiles )??

NOW the AOE hitbox of the mag is 1.77 which is a little less than the footprint of a house.

IMO… I see the circle shrunk massively but I wanna see how gameplay changes due to this fact; esp 1v1 play.

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If this server side patch will continue i believe that when something is drastically overpowered/underpowered changes can be made faster.

This nerf is the direct result of the vast amount of complains on the subject. So they took the drastic (card games aproach) of going overboard.

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No the seige needed a nerf for a long time finally the devs are nerfing seige to not make them op and make the game fun. No seige needs no buffs.


Nah, the nerf works fine. The only siege I’d like to see is a ram on the field and a treb down the road.

Everything else is too hard to deal with when spammed.

Haven’t played since the patch are bombards and nest of bees still OP?

It’s one thing to nerf a unit and another to delete. I find the variety fun, not the impossibility of not taking out a unit or not making a viable strategy.


Of course, whenever there are ten or more.

Right you are, I completely agree, however, I already deal with the many brick walls that block how I would like to make viable strategies for early aggression and more complex micro fights, so the full removal of the last King Blobwar unit doesn’t bother me at all.

If they want a unit to be viable, they should also make it work in the game ecosystem like a native, not an invasive species, as was the scenario for Mangonels.

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Hardly the first time Relix has “gone overboard” with AoE IV balancing… newest Camel Archer nerf overboard as well.

I played my first session since this change today and while it’s a small sample it feels absolutely exhilarating to be able to build a wider range of units without having to think about massed mangonels and massed springalds. I was able to use a vibrant composition of units and win for the first time in a long time, and didn’t feel punished for not building masses of knights or masses of springalds.

No doubt more changes around siege will be necessary but this was a gigantic, gigantic breath of fresh air.


I prefer this metagame to the old one, but I also think that you have to find the most perfect balance possible to increase the variety of builds, units and ways of playing the civ, giving greater strategic richness.


New meta. Mass crossbowman for the win :))