They were OP right after the launch of the civ. But they have been nerfed already economically and military.
They are fine now. Still very strong but predictable.
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You can easily tell apart if a hand cannoneer is balanced or not:
Just make them fight against Spanish, Turk, Portuguese, Burgundian hand cannoneer or against Elite Janissaries in equal resources.
If this hand cannoneer beats all of them by a large margin, then it’s unbalanced.
Before the patch, the Italians hand cannoneers were already defeating Elite Janissaries cost-effectively. It was still okay because they weren’t as pop efficient as Elite Janissaries. Anyone who has a bit of understanding of balance would see the problem from miles away, what would happen if the fully upgraded and discounted Italian hand cannoneer had also gotten two additional combat bonuses.
Result of Hindustani hand cannoneers isn’t surprising either. Because other combat bonuses buff units linearly, while range bonuses buff units exponentially. Outranging means also hitting first, bumping less, reloading first, escaping from danger easier, and being more accurate at closer range. So this +2 range isn’t just +2 range basically, because there are a lot of other bonuses also going on underneath.
And if your opponent lacks Bracer, “Shatagni” is just auto win button for you.
Gurjaras were the ones I remember being called OP, though now they seem to be suffering
Oh look, the exact same complaint again. At least this time you didn’t try sneaking it into an unrelated thread again.
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Hindustanis are a good example how just slightly tweaking the numbers have huge effects.
Back when their Villager discount was 10/15/20/25 there were the clear #1, when it was nerfed to 5/10/15/20 they dropped like 30 ranks or so, and now with 8/13/18/23 they are slightly overtuned.
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Actually they dropped because of a double nerf on villagers cost + nerf Ghulams.
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Talking about Ghulams, I wonder why they didn’t get the renamed Eagle armor. People already treat them as unofficial Eagle units.
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Ghulams have most of Eagle’s advantages but without Eagle’s weakness to the militia line.
In contrast, Ghulams deal extra damage to Eagles despite them acting like Eagles.
Luckily, both Aztecs and Incas have answers to them, but no clue if Mayan Eagles still cost-effectively trade with Ghulams.
I start to agree with those who tell that you are a troll. You would like Turks to be the only dominant civ of the game.
Your standard is wierd that
(1) you don’t think janissaries is unbalanced when it has 8 range to beat mangonel effectively in Castle age.
(2) When Janissaries lose without micro against certain HC, that civ HC should nerf.
Option 1:
Jan: +1 range +%5 accuracy
E.Jan: +6 HP +%5 accuracy
Option 2:
HC: -2 attack, +2 bonus damage against infantry and no bonus damage to spearman.
Jan: +1 attacks +%10 accuracy.
E.Jan: +%10 accuracy + cheaper elite upgrade cost.
I think so Turks deserve it extra one unique unit
Heres my idea’s
Deli (unique Hussar with demoralization) makes -1 / -1 armor lower when close to opponent units
Sipahi (Unique Steppe Lancer with swap weapon (Lance and mace or Scimitar/Yataghan) ) when first charge happanned swap to sword or mace similliar like Coustillier from Burgundy but Lance has a 1 range and anti mounted units damage
Azap infantry (unique Pikemen but more faster attack and move speed or promote every unit kill )
Alps(replace as Knights) and Kapıkulu (Qapykulu) (Unique Cavalier with trample damage and using mace upgrade cost 400-400) Unlike Cavalier, it is a bit expensive upgrade
While I appreciate the idea, I do not think that it is the right timing to discuss Turks. Many people have PTSD (i.e. post-Turk spamming disorder) currently.
4 Likes
I would never trade Sipahi over any new kind of new unit.
Sipahi tech is can be rework as like %10 Attack speed for Hussars named as Yataghan maybe ?
haha but Turks are is one of the oldest civilzation in AoE 2 and Jans are i think so “weak” more then other Hand Canoneers
i saw about that video on youtube name as “Does the Janissary need a Buff or Nerf?? Age of Empires 2” from Demon AgeofEmpires2
and i believe all civs deserve seccond unique units such as unique Briton spearmen or Briton Cavalry
i believe Turks and all single unique units civs deserve extra unique units like Persians
No Sipahi means dying even harder to Conquistadors, other cavalry archers, and archer + pike combo. And Turks don’t have much options against good Camels either.
Cav archers were left as the only good unit after Janissaries were nerfed into the ground unfairly. Removing Sipahi is not much different than removing Turks from the game.
As for second unique unit; I have no strong opinion about it, but maybe they can get a unique ship similar to Turtle Ship stats or an unique upgrade for Elite Cannon Galleons. The Ottomans were one of the prominent naval powers, so this addition would fit well.
You should ignore (or better yet yell at) Il Selim because he is trolling.
2 Likes
The name of the civilization is not Ottoman, Turks and Ottomans are not good at sea except for exceptions like Barbaros Hayreddin, Instead, it would be better to add land units to the game
Also, I suggested three different units other than the sipahi, and the sipahi technology is not as good as you think
unless i never research Sipahi tech because not powerful against Huns,Mongols and Tatars, Sipahi tech makes tanky CA but not stronger then others remember it! Huns, Mongols and Tatars has a CA passive bonusses and also Tatars have Silk armors make even stronger against The Turks CA
only one pros about Sipahi tech is cheaper then Silk armor
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“Turks” in the game represent both the Ottoman and Seljuk era, but not the pre-Seljuk era, which is represented by the Tatars. That’s why the Turks still have Middle Eastern architecture instead of the Central Asian one.
And the Ottomans were indeed a prominent naval power.
I came up with an idea before
BUT I don’t think that Turks need a new unique unit! They are probably fine as is and just need something to help them in Arabia a bit more