Tell me in which team game tournament did we see any Elephant other than the Khmer or Malay BE ?
Have a look at BOA 1,2 and 3
Have a look at Clan Masters
Have a look at Nations Cup
Any other TG tournament or SHOWMATCH
That is what I mean by serious games.
Same case with the poor Turtle Ships.
team game with lots of big names. if it can work there it can easily work in tournaments.
and Max had to come back from being nearly dead and still managed to pump them out.
Any TG tournament Game or SHOWMATCH Game
That is what I mean by serious games. It get serious when actual money and actual honor (and not ELO points) is on the line
Regular ranked play is not so serious for players who are already in the top 30 (except maybe Hera who is always try-hard).
But Hera also never makes Elephants, he goes only meta.
Same case with the poor Turtle Ships.
how is it fair to put qualifiars on it? you eliminate 2/7 elephants right off the bat. seems totally fair. oh wait no.
just because you donāt view it as serious doesnāt mean it isnāt. its got literally most of the big stars including Viper, Hera, Vivi, Yo, and TheMax
and thatās why i donāt watch hera. dude could literally be playing a game against his followers who sit at 1200 elo and would full meta try hard.
It is because 5/7 is a vast majority of Elephants
Indian Elephant Archers
Persian War Elephants
Khmer Ballista Elephants
Vietnamese Battle Elephants
Burmese Battle Elephants
ALL NEVER EVER SEEN in Serious play.
All seen as frequently as Indian Battle Elephants. 
ZERO
Same case with the poor Turtle Ships.
by your standard of serious play*
btw, we saw war elephants in HC3.
how many in total? 
like 5? I think 3
doesnāt matter. you said you wanted to see them in āSerious playā.
there you go. you saw them.
If you get to put insane stipulations like āKhmer and Malay BE donāt countā iām going to throw even the most ludicrious examples at you.
Dude our conversation started about only Persian War Elephants.
And then we discovered there are these 4 other Elephants thrown under the bus as well.
Indian Elephant Archers
Khmer Ballista Elephants
Vietnamese Battle Elephants
Burmese Battle Elephants
(and, wait for itā¦ Indian Battle Elephants)
.
As Turtles are the Elephants of the Water, they too are thrown under the bus in serious play.
coming from the guy with insane standards this means nothing.
you literally consider tournament games the only serious games.
i see elephants used all the friggen time. but hey, keep deluding yourself into think tournament games are the only games that matter.
in a video game. designed for fun.
I categorically and clearly said there are 2 types of serious games
It is now an e-sport, designed for competition, contests and audience appeal.
And we want to make it one, as that is the only good future for AOE2.
Because it is an e-sport now, all units especially unused UUs must be balanced unit-wise and quick
i.e. Unit Balance, not just Civ Balance.
those pretty much go hand in hand. you rarely see showmatches without them being associated with a tournament.
but here you go. showmatch. viper vs mbl. we see Ballista Elephants.
Ok score 1 for Ballista Elephants.
What about
Indian Elephant Archers
Persian War Elephants
Vietnamese Battle Elephants
Burmese Battle Elephants
We already covered war elephants. =D HC3 is calling you!
All you achieved for all of your vehement arguments against UU buffs here, is proving that out of all 5 UNVIABLE Elephant types, a few Ballista Elephants were used ONCE in a serious game.
really? if they are unviable why do you outlaw the use of Khmer/Malay BE?
also i showed you War Elephants being used already in HC3.
sorry you donāt like it.
if you include those, iāve seen 4 out of 7 elephants.
and there hasnāt been a whole lot of chance to use the buffed EA in tournaments or showmatches.
and Vietnamese almost never go for them for because they are an archer civ.
funny how you immediately decline to allow 2 in that swing the numbers the way you want themā¦
Did you not read this?
Which are clearly
Indian Elephant Archers havenāt had a chance to see play.
Khmer Ballista ELephants iāve seen about a dozen times.
Persian War Elephants iāve already showed you.
Vietnamese are an archer civ and are going to proiritize that.
so congrats. you got me on the two civs who likely wonāt use them. Viet and Burmese.
4/7 have used them in tournaments!. 1/7 hasnāt had a chance. 2/7 belong to civs that focus elsewhere.
Like a couple made in all of the tournament, that you handpicked, HC3
Are you sure? In Tournament/Showmatch games? Like true competitive games?/