I’d probably feel ok with it (or at least more ok with it) if it was a one-off. But the way I see it, Three Kingdoms was just one (significant) step in a process that has been going on for the past few years, in which the devs have been gradually moving AoE2 away from what it used to be. I feel like the game has become very bloated and inconsistent in all kinds of ways, and that new content typically doesn’t fit into the game comfortably. Three Kingdoms is the most conspicuous example of this, but not the only one. As a result of all this, I’ve barely played AoE2 for months. Too early to tell whether the upcoming DLC will bring me back to the game, and if so, for how long.
3 Likes
False. Several of them are broken right now.
I hate it and I stopped playing the game shortly after the release of this DLC.
It’s not just about the Khitans, Wei, Wu and Shu. It’s also the addition of Rocket Carts and Fire Lancers to so many civs.
1 Like
Not from a history or timeline perspective, balance wise problematic new civs have been nerfed last patch. Pastures cost more wood and are built slower. Shu lumberjacks generate relatively 29% lesser food. Both these slow down their respective civs’ castle age timings and the potential extra resources they can float. So no, none of them are broken right now balance wise.
Exactly 2 other old civs have rocket carts and 3 old civs have fire lancers. How can 2 or 3 out of 45, be “too many”.
1 Like
I don’t like the 3k DLC overall but still I respect your opinion even though I’d suggest to consider the historical and aesthetical coherence too, not only maths and numbers. That said, even if the dlc may have some merit, mostly for the pure gameplay part as you said, don’t expect anyone willing to admit it here.
1 Like
Yes I know that’s the perspective of many people and that’s the missed opportunity with the DLC. If they did take care of those as well, the DLC could have been a huge hit and led to a drastic growth in player numbers.
1 Like
I do admit some of the scenarios are nice (Liu Bei 4 belongs to my favourite in the entire game). They suffer by the cuts made to the history (or the novel plot) however, and I only stopped being confused after watching documentaries about the fall of the Han dynasty.
Can’t speak for the campaign as I didn’t look much into it. Ignoring the out of place magical and RPG elements it seems ok though pretty generic.
For me the positives that came with the DLC are regional units like fire lancers, rockets carts and, even if not that well implemented, Lou Chans, the boxi camel, grenadiers, the new skins for Asian units (cavalry, cavalry archers, infantry)… lots of nice units if you ignore the context and take them as scenario objects. Even the bleed and lingering mechanics are good to me, the others not so much but well… at least you can mod them in.
In the end it’s really the whole 3k thing being fucked up. That makes you sort of forget the rest.
1 Like
Vibe = dogpoo
The Three Kingdoms element should have always been a Chronicles-style aside, as the period 3K covers is not covered AOEII. It’s a lazy shoe-in that assumes AOEII players are stupid regarding historical knowledge.
The non-3K civs added were more appreciated, however I’d have been more keen for a DLC that focuses more on AOEII era Chinese civs as a whole, rather than the 3K stuff - that would allow more love and care on civs such as Khitans which are a mess of other civs (hint, hint, Tanguts would have been more appreciated than 3k civs).
It’s an annoying milestone in AOE2 dlcs that I hope doesn’t get repeated. If this was more in line ‘Dynasties of India’ - adding purely to timeline cohesive China-region civs (but not removing the ‘main’ China!) I’d be far more positive.
Heck, as a money-spinning point, surely making a Khitan, Jurchen and Tangut DLC pack and a totally separate 3K dlc (again, much in the vein of a Chronicles type of affair) would have been much bettter? All players that want more civs get more civs that fit, and all that niche bunch who want Romance of the Three Kingdoms stuff for AOE2 get that, then those completists buy the whole lot.
14 Likes
Honestly it feels like they were working on something else considering what the 3K Civs are like. For example the Wei having a Tang Dynasty Cavalry unit as it’s Unique Unit, their Wonder being a Xianbei monument and also having a secondary UU that is the Xianbei Raider. Aside from that they there’s the fire archer feeling like it was originally a gunpowder unit and the Shu War Chariot feeling reminiscent of Ming Dynasty cart based siege weapons similar to a Rocket Cart.
Imo what happened is that they were working on the East Asia DLC but they saw how highly praised Chronicles was for it’s storytelling and wanted to make something similar. The 3K campaign looks very similar to Chronicles for this reason and it’s also why they focused so much on getting the pronunciation in the VA work right. This would also explain why a lot of elements feel rushed and sorta out of place.
In their mind this would’ve been successful because it’s like chronicles and 3K is a very popular subject in Chinese pop culture. Too bad the story they were trying to tell was extremely poorly told even if the gameplay in the campaigns was good. Otherwise I don’t think anyone even wanted this, not even people who are into Chinese history.
10 Likes
Yeah I’ve got a similar feeling.
1 Like
I’d totally play a Chronicle based on 3K ngl, assuming it was DONE RIGHT. More scenarios so that the story is understandable without knowing the source material, and no character assassination (I’ve started to read about Cao Cao and I’m dumbfounded how the devs managed to turn this fascinating dude into a one-dimensional warlord…)
Edit: plus the ahistorical outcomes feel cheesy
2 Likes
I also feel there was some major missed opportunity with this. Like if say they went with their original idea of the Wei being the Xianbei/Northern Wei/Tang Dynasty representation. Then they could’ve done a campaign about Hua Mulan, which is known both in China because of it being a the other most recognisable story in their culture and in the West because of that Disney film. That story barely fits into the AoE2 timeframe and Mulan herself was from the Northern Wei. It would’ve also fit in either the rest of the campaigns since AoE2 loves telling stories about female historical figures (Joan of Arc, Jadwiga, Yodit, Tamar.)
3 Likes
I would definitely NOT hate 3K (but still wouldn’t buy it) if this is what they admit, or at least sugarcoat, not some cringe bs like “YES FIVE NEW CIVS”, “we have a specific story to tell”, “they are actually very medieval”
1 Like
Mulan is a fictional character.
1 Like
It has some historical inspiration.
I see nothing on Wikipedia that indicates that.
The original story is a folk song called the Ballad of Mulan (Mulan Ci). It was composed during the Northern Wei Dynasty (386–534 AD). Because it was an oral tradition, there are several translations, but the core verses remain the same.
Here is a standard English translation of the original poem:
The Ballad of Mulan
Tsiek tsiek and again tsiek tsiek,
Mulan weaves, facing the door.
You don’t hear the shuttle’s sound,
You only hear Daughter’s sighs.
They ask Daughter who is in her heart,
They ask Daughter who is on her mind.
“No one is on Daughter’s heart,
No one is on Daughter’s mind.
Last night I saw the draft posters,
The Khan is calling many troops.
The army list is in twelve scrolls,
On every scroll there is Father’s name.
Father has no grown-up son,
Mulan has no elder brother.
I want to buy a saddle and horse,
And serve in the army in Father’s place.”
In the East Market she buys a spirited horse,
In the West Market she buys a saddle,
In the South Market she buys a bridle,
In the North Market she buys a long whip.
At dawn she takes leave of Father and Mother,
In the evening she camps on the Yellow River’s bank.
She doesn’t hear the sound of Father and Mother calling,
She only hears the Yellow River’s flowing water cry tsien tsien.
At dawn she takes leave of the Yellow River,
In the evening she arrives at Black Mountain.
She doesn’t hear the sound of Father and Mother calling,
She only hears Mount Yan’s nomad horses cry tsiu tsiu.
She goes ten thousand miles on the business of war,
She crosses passes and mountains like flying.
Northern gusts carry the rattle of army pots,
Chilly light shines on iron armor.
Generals die in a hundred battles,
Stout soldiers return after ten years.
On her return she sees the Son of Heaven,
The Son of Heaven sits in the Splendid Hall.
He gives out promotions in twelve ranks,
And prizes of a hundred thousand and
1 Like
The ballad is fictional.
2 Likes