it does not suck, it’s awesome
it does not suck, it’s awesome
I just played through it and its really boring not to mention buggy…
the mission with the amazons is really tedious on the giant map and with all the canoes its so easy to lose your transports which completely screw you over…the mission where you get pulled into a transport and carted over had a bug where I could never even complete it…
and the last mission which…is probably the MAIN reason its not in the game…was not only tedious with the quests but damn… the entire mission revolved around a local group of cannibals called ‘negros’ and the amount of times they say the ‘bloodthirsty negros’ or something to that effect was kind of crazy…I never played it at the time so just loaded up HD recently to play through it and yeah…I think the combination of this mission along with tedious missions lead them to just make a new one.
5 Likes
Basically what DIABLOxHITMAN said above me. It could have been a public relationships move to have removed the entire El Dorado campaign. They also removed any mention of Sundjata being born of an ugly and deformed woman, and thus not fit to rule, for the exact same reason.
They could fine an alternative for that word? I get that is sensitive, but to scrap a whole campaign on the premis of a few audio bits seems to be a fierce excageration.
For the record, I am not in favour of scrapping historic accuracy just to make it more political correct. If the tribe was called negro’s, or the Spanish called them that, it should be reflected as such. That’s not a call for racism, it’s an accurate reflection of the racism being used by the Spanish. It’s like changing the Montezuma campaign, stating Cortez only punched a random guy in the face, opposed to slaughtering thousands of people, just to make it sound more friendly towards children.
2 Likes
Really? This was a wrong thing to do. Real world has a lot of bad things in it and games should not hide them. Games are our opportunity to experience them without it really affecting our lives.
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This is a really dumb change. This was one of the core parts of the original story and one of the contributing factors why the first wife exiled Sundjata and his mother in the first place. In fact, the entire prophecy aspect is gone. Did people really had an issue with Sundjatas mother being ugly?
I understand the “negros” situation, but even if that was the reason why the Campaign was removed (I don’t think it is, I think it’s because the Campaign in general isn’t great and it’s basically another Spanish Campaign, which El Cid already fills that role), the name could have been simply changed. The enemy tribe was likely Marajoara or perhaps even Caribs.
2 Likes
Yeah an alternative word would be ■■■■■■, which I don’t think is any better. Negro is the “nicer” word for dark skinned peeps
Yeah, I’d be cool with that. Just saying, if the Spanish of that time used the word negro in a cruel and/or downlooking way, the game should not shy away from displaying that cruelty. History is there to learn from, and history should be accurate.
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This whole El Dorado censor thing is stupid. Remove it because spanish were racist? What’s next then, are they gonna erase from the history books that africans were enslaved back in the days?
1 Like
No, they will censor that any other people were enslaved and only africans were enslaved (but only by the europeans, they will remove any african tribe enslaving each other).
Need to censor how the american tribes enslaved and sacrificed each other too. Montezuma campaign is too political incorrect, with slavery, sacrifices and natives aiding the Spanish to kill other natives.
1 Like
How about people stop being giant idiots about the entire thing and stop assuming that is the reason why it was removed. There are tons of reasons why the campaign was removed.
El Dorado was probably removed because the Campaign in general wasn’t great, a giant slog to go through and in general, wasn’t fun.
El Dorado was probably removed because out of all of the Campaigns (except for the original Honfoglalás and one of the Dracula Scenarios), El Dorado was the most scripted and trigger heavy out of the entire DLC, complete with complicated sidequests, “quest givers” and the like which doesn’t really work in AoE2 in practice. Not to mention Scenario 3, which is a complete and confusing nightmare.
El Dorado was probably removed because it was another Spanish Campaign in the guise of an Inca Campaign and the developers decided that an actual Inca Campaign would be much better.
El Dorado was probably removed because the Forgotten Campaigns were moving away from the “Hero Mission” / RPG Style gameplay that plagued and people criticized heavily about the original Forgotten Campaigns, into more traditional “Base Buidling” scenarios, which you can’t really do with the “Pizarro and Orellana Expedition”, which was basically a hundred Conquistadors and a couple thousand Allied Natives and “Allied” Natives going through the Amazon and that is about it.
But you guys are probably right. It was because of “Los Negros”. No way for the developers to get around that, gotta create a completely new campaign from scratch to avoid it.
I wasn’t going to comment further on it since people were starting to be idiots about the entire thing and I don’t want to be banned by other people taking things too far, for getting involved, but since people are not stopping to be idiots, I have to chime in.
There is no historical evidence that the hostile natives encountered at the mouth of the Amazon River were “Los Negros”, nor did they even encounter any hostile natives at that part outside of a few small skirmishes. The only mention of “Negros” in documents on the expedition, with regard to a human being, is when Francisco de Orellana explicitly stated that he sent “Two Negros” with a handful of his men to find food, sometime during middle-end of the expedition, but since the Spanish Empire did not have African Slaves during the era, nor did they use the word as a general insult (which is what everyone here is implying for some reason), the “Negros” in question were likely captives from the “Rio Negro” or “Black River”, which was named because the water in the river was unusually deep and dark compared to the other rivers encountered in South America.
In fact, there is absolutely no reason for the “Negros” name to be used in the first place for Scenario 4. It’s obviously not used in any other context besides referring to a name of a tribe that the Spanish gave them. But in order for that to work, the Scenario would have to take place near modern day Manaus, which is near the Rio Negro, which is just before where the Conquistadors constructed the second Brigantine ship. But that takes place before the infamous battle with the Amazons, which is Scenario 3 and the Scenario (4) clearly takes place at the basin of the Amazon River on the Marajo and nearby Islands and is an exaggeration of the crew taking over two weeks repairing the ships to take them to the Atlantic Ocean to Venezuela. There is absolutely no evidence that the Natives encountered there were given the name “Los Negros” and like I said before, they could easily change the name to “Marajoara”, “Caribs” or even just “Hostile Natives”, just like the first two scenarios.
Honestly, the entire thing is a mess when you actually look into the actual historical context of the expedition and compare it with the exact Scenario in question.
7 Likes
Dracula is the same on some levels though
Can confirm that Dracula’s map layouts are generally the same. Objectives are changed slightly but only Dracula 1 was completely new in terms of map I think, even then the objective is very similar to the original.
The whole disguised Dracula is gone in m3 though. And the sneak mission
A Mayan campaign on the Star Wars between Tikal and Calacmul would be awesome. But I think we need more Mesoamerican skinned units/buildings. Maybe some Tapirs and Caimans and Anacondas too.
Of course they remade the El Dorado campaign because it was too bugged and weird, specially with this “RPG” style that the original FE campaign had that I hated. Historically it was a mess too. This “los negros” things is irrelevant.
But tell me, why they changed this one:
“They also removed any mention of Sundjata being born of an ugly and deformed woman, and thus not fit to rule”
This REALLY looks like censorship, specially how relevant to the campaign history it is.
1 Like
I already commented on it and said it was a very dumb change. I agree it shouldn’t have been changed an I don’t see why, if anyone, would be offended that Sundjata’s mother was ugly. Ugly people, maybe, but I feel that they would relate to the story more than to be offended by it.
1 Like
We’ve never seen his mum so who knows. She could’ve been white skinned (European decent) lol
I was saying it was for multiple reasons. the last mission just being one of them. If you’re looking at an unpopular, uninteresting campaign thats tedious and buggy that also has a rather odd sensitive mission…why have it? you’re going through the rest of them why not change this one out completely with an actual incan one that actually fits AOE?
the rest of the campaigns got totally overhauled and no ones really pushing for the old versions.is it just because this got a name change that we care more about this one?
This, I want to play both campaigns. 