To be fair, this nonsense did exist before KotM. Arsonists are probably the worst example and that’s from TAD.
But having the super lame “royal _____” for every second native unit and then still flubbing it by also making a mercenary “royal _____” is an impressive achievement in inconsistency.
I think this card is useless for now.So I have two advices for it.Those can make this card more useful and not break the balance,and also shows the European’s technological superiority in that period.We can choose one of those two.
But first,I think we should change something first.We should remove the ‘send 1 Mortar’ bonus of this card first(keep the ‘Mortar and Horse Artillery can be trained in the Fortress Age’ bonus).Then add a new bonus for this card.
I have two advices:
1.all artillery will +1 range,and -10% cost
or
2.allow you train the Lil bombard in tavern/saloon/lombard from age 4
+1 range on artillery would be insanely strong. It’d be made less bad since almost all Euro civs have it, but that’d still wreck the already poor, late game balance between Euro civs and non-euro civs (on average the European civs are stronger).
Advanced Artillery is a very niche card. 1 mortar is fairly weak, but it is good for breaking turtle builds. Not everything needs to be equally valuable in all situations. Removing the mortar hurts a lot for it’s current main use case.
Lil’ bombards aren’t too valuable vs a civ with culvs, but I’d imagine dealing with them using Arrow Knights would be pure pain.
The card as it is now is not useless it can help break through strong defenses without you having to go into Industrial Age.
Buffing Artillery with more range and cheaper costing should absolutely not be done when you have civs that have hard time dealing with cannons already.
Li’l Bombards are expensive and slow to train and move so slowly and just being able to unlock them with card would be used less competitively also Portuguese can already unlock Li’l Bombards with the Age III The Mercenary Contractor Age Up so…
The card needs no changes. It is a good situational card as is.
Infact I think they are very powerful,but they should be 3.5 speed,and the Papal Bombard should also be 3.5 speed,just like the Great Bombard.This will not break the balance. 
But other countries don’t have the way to build them if they don’t see them in the tavern
1.They should have 3.5 speed(from 2.5),just like the great bombard.They are heavy cannons,so they should have normal heavy cannon’s speed.Papal bombard is a piece of junk,Lil Bombards are expensive and slow to train,and cost 8 pop,so this will not break the balance.
2.Papal bombard’s rate of fire should be 6(from 7),I think they don’t cost as much as the Lil,so they should be weaker than the Lil.
3.Both of those two can have 1.25X vs buildings,just because they have already received the debuff to the cavalry and shock infantry,should have something pay back
4.Lil Bombard should cost 1200 coin(from 1100),because we receive the buff,we must pay the bill.
@EricTheRed283 @Kingfisher1787
Friends,what do you think about it?
And if Lil is like this,not like present,the advice ‘Advanced artillery’ allow players train Lil from age 4 will be more useful?
@FastSpark431808 If possible, please stop creating so many threads about artillery and start using only this thread.
Advanced Artillery is mostly a 1v1 card. It’s purpose is breaking enemy fortifications without needing to go age 4. It’s niche, but getting a mortar and being able to train mortars is great vs (for example) Inca spamming Strongholds in your face. Strongholds do a ton of damage, and without Mortars you either have petards or a really, really slow DPS option with Culvs.
Edit: just to clarify, I’m saying the card is fine as is.
Culverin should actually gain the ability against other artillery, especially counter the Protogural’s Grapeshot Organ Gun. The 4 speed artillery can run as fast as musketeer and kill all the things include cavalry and culverin which was designed to counter that op artillery.
The simpler fix there would be removing the +15% artillery hp card from Portugal. Without that card, one Imperial Culv can 1-shot an Imperial Organ Gun. Currently, a Fully Upgraded OG can survive 2 similarly upgraded Culv shots (first hit leaves it with like, under 10hp). This would also help culv-less civs some, even if it’s not as big of a change.
Edit: due to how the breakpoints work, I think it roughly doubles the efficiency of Culvs vs Organ Guns in imperial, but doesn’t really change anything in IV. Fortunately, massing Organ Guns mostly happens in team, which usually get up to V if anyone actually ends up making lots of Organ Guns.
I think the “Advanced Artillery” card would be used a lot more if instead of 1 Mortar it sends 1 Horse Artillery.
The problem is the card has functionally become “ships 1 Mortar” and that’s it. That is not in keeping with the intent of the original card.
It was severely underpowered before, but buffing it should involve changes that actually facilitate training Mortars or Horse Artillery. Using it to train Horse Artillery needs at least an 850 resource investment on top of the card which is way too steep. Even a 2nd Mortar is an additional 700 resource investment.
Instead of shipping a Mortar, shipping a Foundry wagon could actually incentivize the intended use. But since that’s a little less valuable than a Mortar, adding in a discount for Foundry techs could compensate. That would also make it less useless if sent in later ages.
A foundry wagon and a mortar could even work.
1 Mortar makes it more worthwhile to send then 1 Horse Artillery would because the Mortar can Bombard buildings from long range to help deal with strong defenses.
Friend,if lil become 3.5 speed,give 1.25X vs buildings,cost 1200 coin,it will be more useful?
And my advice 'Advanced artillery can allow build lil from age 4 'will be more usefuf?
What if 1 mortar shipment is given to china and india who lack strong long range mortars as one time help. Hand mortars can be strong, but you need a lot if them trained from castles and SEles arent famous due to their range so it could work.
Also, as said uncountable times in these forums, SE shouldnt be countered by skirmishers like any other canon
Buffing Lil Bombards is a separate question imo. Idk about your suggestion there, I haven’t used/fought them recently enough to comment on specific stats.
My main point is that Advanced Artillery, if any buff is required would be one that improves tempo, like adding an Artillery Foundry Wagon. The card is kinda slow (ie low tempo because the resource value is low) and being able to train LBs isn’t something likely to make me take it unless maybe I’m playing Dutch and planning to spam mercs in age 5.
BUT MUH AZAP
Also
They did that because culvs were vulnerable to melee infantry, while siege eles, being fast, high HP, but not cav, were not.
So you needed another counter.
It is NOT any other canon.
