What if spearmen only cost food?

It seems unfair. Very hard to spam spearmen since wood gathering is painfully slow in early game. If they cost only food, I can use the excess wood to make wooden walls and farms help me reach castle age.

With cheaper spearmen I can put up an early defence against a scout rush. Rushing has been significantly buffed with the nerfs to defences already.

Very hard to wall up unlike AOE 2 HD. Much easier to wall in that older game.

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Uh what? Wood gathers faster then food.

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Between the need for walls, farms, and houses it’s painfully slow. You need so many lumberjacks. Topped off with making spearmen, which also cost wood.

Welcome to the early game.

Imagine how it feels for food.
You need food for vills, upgrades, military…

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Wait what? ^^
Easier to collect food than wood?
Not only that wood collection is depending on the upgrades like 30-40 % faster, you don’t even need farms to collect it.

But I generally like the idea for separating the cost of the trash units more.

scouts - 100 % F
spears - 66.7 % F
skirms - 33.3 % F

This way there would be a difference in the ecos needed to make these trash units. You would have to be more committed to one trash unit with your eco setup, making it harder to switch if the opponent makes a different unit than you want to counter.

In general - I think a lot of the recent repetitive gameplay issues and established meta come from the sheer fact that the meta gameplay abuses the lack of commitment to certain strats. It’s too easy to eg make a standard-sized knight rush and then transition into booming behind.
I think to make more interesting gameplay with different strategies we should make the individual strats more destinct. So we get a higher commitment for the individual strats and less fluid transitions inclined in one all-dominating meta.

Making the counters more distinct in their ressource requirements can be one part of that.

Well you can just stop making farms for the time being?
Maybe you also set up your eco wrong and put too much on food whilst going up to feudal. It’s a common mistake of unexperienced players.

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Whenever i saw a post about spearman line, i feel like i am playing a different game. 11. Yes, spamming spearman in feudal is a pain, pikeman is not good at castle age but in the imp, halbediers dominating whole game with a little bit siege support. 60 hp fast and cheap units outnumber and kill archers, hand conners( which cost gold) and skirmhers, wrecking cavs, heavy infanty need gold and dies to cav, archers, siege etc so they are not an proper answer and half of the topics about cost discount or upgrade discount for spearman line. Hell no, spearman line need cost increase. Like 40 food 30 wood etc.

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Sounds like an idea (only foor or only wood) for an imp UT…

Like a vey cheap spearman line in the late game

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Trash units are, by design, a bit hard to tech into, and must be a bit underwhelming, so that they aren’t a blind go-to pick. Units like Skirms, for example, already have good power, as they snipe vills in Castle Age and have a bit of offensive power even vs their counter, Knights, as long as they fight next to TC and the Knights only have +1 armor.

Spearmen are meant to slow your growth a bit so that the game, which is already very biased toward the defender, isn’t even more defender-sided. Knights, Crossbows, Mangonels are supposed to be hard to stop in Castle Age, and are arguably already too easy to stop. If Spearmen cost only food to train, you could beat ANY Knight civ by doing a setup of something like, 24 farmers, 3-4 TCs, whatever amount of Wood villagers is needed to make Castle Age buildings, meanwhile the Knight player is likely 1-2 TC and investing all his food into Knights. You would beat the Knight aggression every time with a faster Imperial Age timing and overall the game would reduce to Skirm vs Skirm every Castle age.

I think already now, the game is fairly well-tuned in terms of gold units and counter units, Skirms counter Archery Range floods but require A LOT of techs, meanwhile Spearmen require fewer techs but need bigger numbers to be effective so they are complemented by (initially) Monks while you build mass. Generally, when it comes down to gold units vs counter units fighting, I see the player with better micro/decision making and that takes better engagements come out on top a good 90%+ of the time, which is a signal that the game is working as intended for the most part. Maybe Pikeman upgrade could be 50f cheaper to help a bit more vs civs with Stable bonus, like Berbers, especially now that Crossbow got a minor nerf.

How much food should cost?
It wouldn’t be a nerf to spearman line?

No additional food cost. I think it would be fine. Kill annoying scouts. Since it much harder to wall these days.

Just cost 35food?
I can see you being rushed with spears and towers even early than scouts opening…

Both sides have a spear brawl.

Both sides have scouts too… why not open scouts and move the agression far away from your base?

so just to clarify: you are seriously suggesting a 40% price reduction on a unit which is already quite popular?

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Defensive game has been nerfed significantly so they have to be buffs in other places. Weaker towers, weaker walls, weaker houses. At this rate, they might as well remove Loom. Since buffs villagers too much.

feel like it will only be balanced if it has negative attack

Too costly for the early game. Hard to spam early. No cheap walls to hide and cry behind. AOE 2 HD walls and towers are better.

attacker needs to build: a stable (175 wood) + 2 scouts (160 food)
defender needs to build: 1 spear (35 food 25 wood)

so the defender needs to spend 20% of the food and 15% of wood. Yet you think the defender needs a buff?

Yes. Aggression is far too awarded. You have people performing these insane rushes as if they are Skynet.

I seen many a replay where a player is attacked while constructing a wall.

scout your opponent - if you see a stable send a spearman to protect the villager who is walling. one spear can beat 2 scouts, it’s already incredibly cheap

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