I mean that “early modern civs” isnt a niche for a DLC unlike the dark ages could be. Theres just too much to cover and a lot (if not most) civs we have gotten in DLCs have been early modern civs.
I mean, we’ve had Western Europe as a theme for a DLC, that’s quite a precedent for non-niche concepts…
As for “a lot of civs if not most” from the DLCs being early modern… For DE I’d say it may be arguably be the case for Poles and Hindustanis (Which are actually the Indians for the Forgotten, so does it really count?), and in HD we may have Italians, Incas, Portuguese and Burmese I guess. Maybe Vietnamese. That’s far from being a majority.
Yeah but by “niche” I dont mean “less popular” but “specific”
And Tatars, Lithuanians, Burgundians are also similarly late civs. Malians and also are an early moderb age civ.
And in general theres few civs out there which are specifically from the early modern period and practically didnr exisr earlier. The only ones I can think of rn is the Azeris and Dutch (and maybe Uzbeks?)
Deccani Muslims can get represented by Hindustanis. They don’t have the numbers either.
Or rather make a Maratha Civ based on Maratha Empire if you want something from that area.
The hell? Tatars is debatable, though with Timur dying in 1405 and Ulugh Beg in 1449 I’d say their golden age ended before the EME, but Lithuania pretty much got absorbed into Poland through personal union around the time the period started and were more active before then, Burgundy were absorbed by France pretty fast after the beginning of this era and were already far less irrelevant than during and before the more active periods of the Hundred Years War and the Mali Empire was on its last leg when the Songhai Empire started dominating the region.
Songhai? Mapuche? Muisca maybe?
And it’s not necessarily about not existing prior to this date (none of those people were born by walking out of the sea fully formed in 1453), it’s more about this period being their time to shine.
Just as much as Kannadas can be represented by Dravidians and Odia by Bengali, all of those are umbrella civs even after DoI.
The Maratha Empire appeared during late 17th century, it’s far outside the game’s time period.
Tatars includes a lot of groups, I would say that wven without analyzing it further the diferent Timurid states and the golden Horde were pretty eñrelevant during the early modern period.
Tbh I would argue thats still onebof if bot their most relevant. The Jagellian dynasty was Lithuanian originally, and Lithuania was only that oowerful duringvthe mid 15th century until the union with Poland in 1521
Burgundy were absorved by France after the fall of the Chimu so I think they fit
They still were a formidable force until the late 15th century I believe.
Nah Muisca dont fit.
The Gao Sultanate was in the 13th century and before a major regional power I believe
I can get behind Mapuche being only an early modern civ tho.
And yes these people existed before that but I meant that they never were a regional power before that
Why exactly…?
Well, clearly the Tatars, Malians, Burgundians and Lithuanians were regional powers before the EME…
Muisca didnt do anything too importantduring the early modern period and existed since the late middle ages. They arent exclusively an early modern civ like the Dutch
Yes but Im talking about two diferent things. I was saying that Tatars, Malians, etc were always relevant before the Early Modern Era while the Dutch werent.
I dont know why you find everything I said in this thread so baffling
And the idea would be a separate mode similar to AoE 1 DE based on this mod…
It is for the HD version.
There are 18 Civilizations in total and their building sets are as follows:
European:
British
French
Germans
Dutch
Canada (They are only achieve the “independence” in 1867,but they are a revolution and have a historical battle in 3 DE)
13 Colonies (Early United States)
Swedish
Eastern European
Russian
Polish (They are not in 3 DE yet)
[image]
Latin:
Spanish
Portuguese
Native American:
Plains Natives Building Set
-Lakota
-Commanche (minor civ in AoE 3)
Forest Natives Building Set
-Cherokee (minor civ in AoE 3)
-Cree (minor civ in AoE 3)
-Iroquois
Meso:
Aztec
Mayan (minor civ in AoE 3)
In the Independance Age, the North American Colonies, Britain and France, and the Dutch, Germans, and Swedes recieve a more specialized set respectively.
The new Ages are:
The Exploration Age - 1492 - 1560
Represents the age of exploration, including famous explorers, and trade with Native populations
The Colonial Age - 1561 - 1699
The age when colonizing of the New World began
Fortress Age - 1700 - 1769
The age when world powers began fighting for control in the New World
Independence Age - 1770 - 1850
Represents events such as the American Revolution, and the War of 1812, when Nations became separate from European Empires. Also represents the era of Napoleon.
Some Key Changes:
All European and American Civilizations start with an explorer unit similar to the one in Age of Empires 3. All Native American Civilizations begin with a similar, Chief, unit.
The Native Embassy is the first buildable military building, replacing the barracks, and trains Native military units.
The Native Embassy has 3 unit lines:
Native Warrior (Melee)
Native Spearman (Melee)
Native Bowman (Ranged)
Native Rifleman is a stand alone unit availible in the independence age.
The Barracks is available to all Non-Natives, and trains the following:
Rifleman line
Crossbowman
Pikeman
Stand alone Grenadier
The Stable trains Cavalry, two lines are present, but only one is available to different Civs:
The Hussar line is available to Europeans.
The Dragoon line is available to Europeans.
The Native Spear Cavalry is available to Natives
The Native Cavalry archer is availible to Natives
The Arsenal trains multiple cannons, including Falconets, Mortars, and 10 - Pounders
Native Civs do not have access to Barracks, but gain extra unit upgrades
The Elder’s Hut is an all new building availible to Natives providing new technologies.
As Native Civs are quite overpowered militarily, they all have strong economic bonuses that reflect the real life native tribes, for example, the Iroquois receive farming bonuses
And last but not least the Mercenary Hut, a building which trains cultural units.
As the mod is not yet complete, any suggestions are very welcome!
Exploration Age Buildings for the Europeans:
Colonial (Commerce) Age Building for the Europeans:
Barracks Unit Roster and Line:
European Native Embassy Roster and Line:
Battle between British and French units
German Town maybe for a Thirty Year War campaign (1618-1648)…
Lakota Town Center and Lakota Horse Archers
French conquest of the British Fort like the Fort Duquesne Historical Battle of AoE 3 DE…
In 1581 so forget it the devs will put them in AoE 2…
Of course, that would be the idea… a separate mode, whoever wants to buy the dlc does so and the base game remains unchanged; similar to how they will do with RoR…
Yes, or at least the Native American civs (Lakota and Haudenosaunee) because many of the European civs from AoE 2 are in AoE 3 (except the Dutch and Swedish since they became empires in the 17th century and Maltese but because it’s a wink to the original campaign)…and you could also add the post-independence nations like the United States and Mexico…
Yes, let’s say AoE3DE can survive on its own, but this mode could serve as a dlc to promote AoE 3 DE within the AoE 2 DE community… AoE 3 DE is an excellent and beautiful game, more after the dlc of the Mediterranean, but it hinders its popularity, the issue of not being like AoE 2 and more like AoM…
Also, that is, AoE 2 is missing a dlc that focuses on the dark ages (400-900): Belisarius, Arab invasions, Charlemagne, but you can have dlc from both periods for that matter…
I proposed on the AoE 3 forums that the devs could put the Uzbeks alongside the Tartars in a dlc similar to The Last Khans but for 3 DE…
Also… the Marathas in AoE 2 would be the Dravidians, the Marathas only appeared in the 17th century, but the Indian civ in AoE 3 has almost no references to the Marathas, but to the Mughals (especially their wonders to advance from age)…
The Tatars were in the Crimea until the middle of the 17th century…Burgundy was divided by France and the HRE in 1477 after the death of Charles the Bold in Nancy…to protect the territories in the Netherlands, his daughter, Maria de Borgoña married Emperor Maximilian I Habsburg and thus these territories became part of the HRE until 1581…
Yes, although the Mapuche would be better for AoE 3…
Sure… as explained above…
The union with Poland was in 1569…
The Chimus were annexed by the Incas in 1470, so they fit in, but you have to know how to differentiate them from the Incas…
They do fit, they lasted almost as long as the Incas (1450-1540)…
Tatars (14th century), Malians (13th and 14th century), Burgundians (15th century) and Lithuanians (14th and 15th century)…
1 Like
I agree, but I think Dynasties of India has sapped my enthusiasm for new civs, because I think the Indian civs (and some other newer civs like Sicilians and Bohemians) have such major issues. It’s hard to get excited for new civs when I expect them to be so unbalanced.
I’d add Koreans and Spanish to that list, and maybe Aztecs (depending on when you think “Early Modern” starts), but I guess you ignored those since they’re so old.
Ok. At the very least, I’d like to see how Return of Rome turns out before making a judgement on this – but it doesn’t seem interesting to me. At best, it’s AoE2 but set in a time period I find less interesting.
I know it’s just a mod, but the naming here feels both lazy and othering to me.
This seems like a pretty silly motivation to add a new game mode to me. A new game mode should be worthwhile in its own right, not just serve as a (bad) advert for something else.
What about Serbs? If Bulgarians can exist, then slavs should e changed to Kievan Rus, and just add more south slav civs.
Honestly the way the devs [don’t?] try to balance things blows my mind sometimes, for the wrong reasons. The cumulative changes have been a net positive, but it just takes them so long to get around to things that very obviously need changing (OP civs as Hindus/Gurjaras were for 4 months last year, or civs that perform poorly in most contexts). To the point where I almost think it’s a lack of the vision or will to do so rather than the type of technical, time, or resource constraints that would be relevant to the progress of other projects. Maybe they’ve been saving it all for “the big update,” but I’ll believe it when I see it.
@MatM1996
In general I wish your posts were more concise and relevant. The pro-gamer move here would be to include a (very) brief description of the mod and how it relates to the topic, and perhaps a link for those interested. Not an extensive copy-paste featuring civs, tech trees, architecture and several other images that no one asked for.
1 Like
Dude, your idea doesn’t really work with some of these picks. I will not partake in the vote since you failed to include Serbia.
That is insulting, considering they’ve existed for nearly a millennium (7-16th century) And had kings and even an emperor that was dubbed the ruler of Serbs and Greeks.
Again, not cool, Serbs deserve way more credit historically being the defenders of Europe against Ottoman rule. Sad.
Marathas are Dravidians? How?
Uh I thought the Muisca were older than that
“They were relevant before thst” I should have said
I would think Serbians would be better represented in a dlc which can focus on the 14th century’s Serbian Empire rather than the struggle against the Ottomans, as aside from a few exceptions in the Americas I tried to avoid as much as possible including civs which clearly had their golden age(s) (so to speak) in the time prior. If you think Serbia is at its best after the dissolution of its empire, then I guess I did something wrong, I probably don’t know the history of the region well enough.
2 Likes
Surprised how poorly Kanembu is doing
Even the Hanseatic League got more votes. It’s so sad.
On the bright side, at least the top 3 most voted are African. I was worried Venetians, Dutch, Austrians,Swedes or Swiss were going to be on top once again.
3 Likes
Yeah, it’s quite a pleasant surprise. I guess people on this forum DO want to see more African civs in the game.
I have to point out Swiss are in the top 5 though. But tbh, I think if a dlc was themed after a time period (and especially this one) it would be ideal to have all civs be from different continents otherwise it would just be a regional dlc in disguise. Ideally I’d like something with one civ from the Americas, one from Africa, one from Asia and probably one from Europe too.
1 Like
If we were to take one early modern civ from each “region”, I would pick Siam from SE Asia, Tarascans from Mesoamerica, Chimu from the Andes and the Hausa from West Africa.
IMO, I would put other African civs together instead in an East African-focused DLC, including the Somali, Swahili, Nubians and Kanembu, in that order of preference
1 Like