Why does turks unique tech Artillery missing attack bonus?

turks r missing Siege Engineers which gives +20% attack.

unique tech Artillery is supposed to be best in its class but its missing attack bonus. it only include range. basically 1+ range and -20% attack compared to others bbc with Siege Engineers. which means turks bbc is inferior to 12 other civs (spanish included because faster damage output) bbc. what is the meaning with Artillery?

damage output is more important than range and hp.

unique tech Artillery is not delivering what its supposed to do.

my suggestion is to include +30% attack bonus in unique tech Artillery


True and this tech is very, very expensive. 500G/450S WTF!! This should cost like Siege Engineers, because its not that good as it’s supposed to be.


Because Siege Engineers + Artillery would be way too powerful.

It works on Bombard Towers and Cannon Galleons, which SE does not.


Who makes Bombard Towers? Why would you pick Turks on water maps?

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I would, if Artillery was as cheap as SE. You would be able to demolish whole Island towns without landing troops.

and losing to Italians and Vikings in Feudal Age 11


Everyone loses to Viking on water in the Feudal Age. Vikings are the Water civ par excellence.

Even Italians, Koreans and Portuguese have no chance.

Portuguese eat Vikings on water any day, but Turks are a trash water civ, so Cannon Galleons are not a reason to not change Artillery.


Losing 20% bonus damage against buildings does not make BBC worse than the alternatives with Siege engineers. It just doesn’t.

This is practically the equivalent of complaining that the E.Longbow is worse than the Arbalest since it’s less accurate even though it’s got an extra range. One range is huge. It means your BBCs stay safer and engage sooner. That can even mean more damage in the long run, not less, if your BBCs survive longer. It also makes them a better anti-Treb unit, which is one of it’s most valuable roles.

Turk BBCs are not as potent as the ones you’d get with Siege Engineer civs, but the Turk BBC makes up for it with the advantage of the range. Anyone who’s argued otherwise hasn’t had to lose many trebs to Turk BBC. It’s a serious problem unit and it can be made even more deadly in the hands of a player who can utilize attack ground.

Well, as problem unit as BBC’s tend to get. Usually BBC doesn’t end your game outside of specific circumstances.


Are you sure about Italians? Italians had 59% win rate while Vikings had 53% in Islands (previous patch). I didn’t check head to head stats though. Currently there are only 2 games from Islands map on the website, so I can’t tell anything but there was no change on balance to change water meta. So I guess Italians still better than Vikings.

They get chemistry for free and their gunpowder units (which includes bombard cannons) have 25% more HP so they can field bombard cannons pretty quickly and sustain them for longer and easier, especially once they research artillery.
I really don’t think Turks need a buff to their bombard cannon game which is pretty damn strong as it is.


Actually if water balance wasn’t so skewed and if cannon galleons were better units maybe Turks would be usable on water.


True. Water is the most boring part of the game, but that is another theme.

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Turks FU BBC have -20% attack against building but +1 range , train faster and they can train immediately after hit imp due to the free chemistry, and +25% more hit point.

They have some drawback of missing siege engineer, but have much effective bonus to compensate that.
It is like Briton Archers. They have less damage output than Vikings, Japanese archer, but more range, train faster. Same with Goths infantry, missing armor but train incredibly fast and cheap.

I would propose artillery give +3 range (total 15) for Turks BBC if we need buff. I don’t think 15 range is broken because it is still less range than Trebs. And make Turks BBC more unique that less building damage but +2-3 more range than other civ, and more incentive to research artillery (Actually, another problem is that it cost too much)


Easy solution
Let Artillery and the Elite upgrade of the Jannissary be affaceted by the Gunpowder techs discount.


Their BBC outranges Teuton castle that’s a lot of value.


downgrade: exclude bbt and cannon ships.

upgrade: add attack bonus on bbc.

Don’t u know that TURKS have no access to siege engineers ??

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If aoe2 was dota maybe more people would play it. What an irrelevant statement. “what if” means nothing. Turks suck on water relative to the power houses. Thus the fact their cannon galleons get extra range means f all.

Yeah it could be something like this. But even then if the tech was just cheaper it would make more sense. Turks already have BBCs with a lot more hp, train faster AND can be trained the moment you reach imperial.

Remember Italians don’t get siege engineers (a gunpowder civ with the worse BBC)

Mongols don’t have the final archer armour for a cav archer civ or the final cav armour for their scouts. Mongols literally revolve around these 2 units.

Cumans don’t have the final attack upgrade for their UU

Berbers don’t have PT for their camel archer.

The list goes on and on for civs lacking key tech for their key units…


Not so irrelevant. Turks only lack fast fire ships on water, so if the water balance allowed for average bonuses and tech tree to be usable then Turks would benefit, as opposed to civs like Cuman which still would suck on water.

Isn’t it exactly what I said? (plus the fact cannon galleons suck really hard and the elite upgrade is on part with elite SL for the least researched elite upgrade)