I dont think I agree with this. This doesnt fix the Houfnice issue and beyond that the civ isnt that problematic
Nerfing all their units because of a single option seems
To me, the ele archers need the extra armor in castle age
This kinda sucks
Idk, Im mixed about this, I think the +2 PA on cavaliers is important for the identity of the tech. If you are going this route may as well drop the knight effect entirely and make it +1/2 and +1 attack and remove gambesons
Vietnamese are a tricky one to balance, but I guess this is a good first step
So what if Muisca being in closer relations to Mexican civs as well Also got the Eagle Warrior? Even if it benefits from the +3 armor bonus and Herbalism or not it would help with mobility and yet it would still be less powerful than other meso eagles with +4 attack vs buildings due to Blast Furnace and Arson as well as Garlands or +40 HP
Is it a priority? Probably not. If there’s room for 5 units for the barracks this could be good right next to the temple guard.
Of course this would likely not be as impactful lategame as they are for Mexicans
Once upon a time keep in mind the Incas UT instead of armor was +10% eagle sling and Kamayuk speed and it was underwhelming as a UT so Muisca would have the same issue
I can see the mining camp upgrade nerf, but why Hoardings? Bohemians are already OP in late game.
Georgians are meant to be a defensive civ, and I think their current Fortified church boost is fine. They are missing 2 man saw, so their wood eco pretty much imperial age generic after the boost. They’re also missing gold shaft mining (so arguably worse than generic). Having an extra 10% boost on top of stone shaft mining is whatever. The farming boost is nice, but still less than Slavs and takes actual investment (and effort) to set up. So their end economy is pretty good overall, but it takes extra investment to get there compared to other civs (investment that is wanted at the same time you’d want to invest into additional TCs). Fitting for a civ that is supposed to be a defensive civ. Their late game is held back by missing BBC, but I think that’s fine.
I do think some of the changes would be good (Korean nerf ok, Roman nerf yes, Vietnamese nerf sounds fine). Faster Onager & co projectile speed should be tested, but is probably a great change (it’s ridiculous seeing archers beat the siege unit meant to hard-counter them)
Georgians are a bottom 5 civ, but people want to nerf them?
Although not shown above, Bohemians are actually not even in the top 10 civs on arena. The number 1 civ on Arena is Malay.
By winrate, the civs that actually need nerfs are the Romans, Malians, Vikings, Chinese, and maybe Malay. And the ones that need buffs are the Inca, Muisca, Mapuche, Armenians, and Georgians.
I think, however, that players are just unfamiliar with the Mapuche strengths and just need to learn them. And with the slinger and champi buffs they will probably be in the >47.5% winrate camp.
Malay could have their faster age up reduced from 66% to 50% and they would probably be fine.
Romans, I suppose, could have their faster eco bonus reduced to 4%; but I would prefer the devs go for a creative solution instead.
Vikings are a bit unexpected, but the free wheelbarrow and hand cart are probably doing a lot of heavy lifting. Perhaps they could have it nerfed to instead of free they are just instant.
Malians are a surprise to me, and I don’t really have any thoughts on them.
And Chinese are, of course, Chinese. Not much that can be done about them.
I only agree to the nerf on Vietnamese that you proposed if the devs buff the generic archer line. If you remove the hp bonus from CA, there is almost no reason to use Vietnamese.
I would accept a CA nerf only if all their equivalents (including elephant archers, camel archers, war wagons, Hussite wagons, and all ranged mobile units) are proportionally nerfed as well.
Mangudai are an exception; they should be kept as is. Compensating Mongol CA wouldn’t be bad either, since they are currently losing even to generic CA in 1v1 in the Imperial Age.
Increasing the projectile speed of the Mangonel line is not a bad idea either. I prefer other siege units’ projectile speeds to be proportionally increased too if that happens.
Buffing Magyar Huszar, nerfing the Portuguese, or removing Byzantine Paladin is out of the question.
Romans (proposal): For every eco or tech researched, villagers gather, build, and repair +1% faster, up to a maximum of +5%. This way, the bonus is something the player actively earns rather than receiving it for free from the start.
I’d also suggest cut down a significant portion of the Romans’ late-game tech tree. They’re too easy to play without needing to make meaningful strategic decisions.
As Ornlu pointed out, during the AoC era, players had to lean into each civ’s strengths. It wasn’t just about defaulting to the CA and skirmisher meta every game.
