I’m doing a 22 maa into archers rush with 1 range and 1 lumber camp. Not only is it such a struggle for resources but I’ve noticed it’s pretty much over unless I do damage with the MAA. It seems way too hard to afford the eco bonuses and it takes way too long to get the castle. I think I’m following a pretty generic build order for it but it’s just not smooth at all.
- you should go for 21 pop MAA (20 + scout). You should know your BO, it’s as follows:
- (optional but useful for the build to be smooth) lure at least 1 deer, I normally lure 2 but to lure 2 AND scout the opponent you need to have relatively good sheep scouting, know where sheep can spawn and be fast at luring, the window to lure 2 is not big overall and you might need to do some small multitasking like pushing deer and luring boar at same time and I’m not sure 1100 elo are comfortable with that. I would say though 1 deer is essential for a smooth MAA build.
- after you get 14 on food, took boar and 4 on berries etc, the 20 pop villager goes to build Barracks then a house. I normally build another 1-2 houses after that but this is optional
- 21 pop vill goes on wood (you should have 5 on wood).
- take 2 from under TC gathering sheep and task them to build a gold mining camp. The goal is to get 10g for the 3rd Militia and 40g for the MAA upgrade.
- as soon as you click up (Barrack finishes at about same time as Loom) you start making Militia. After you make 3 run them across the map and priority targets are Mill/Berries (forcing repairs on Mill early is kinda good but careful at higher elo you can get walled in). Your goal is to force him off resources and with good Scout blocking I reckon in 1.1k elo you can easily get 2 Villager kill systematically.
- while all this is happening, your priority in Feudal is: get 2x bit axe (#1 priority), drop Archery Range (#2 priority), and then task 3 on gold. I would say, first few Feudal vills go to wood. Depending on your civ (Huns, Ethiopians, Persians…) you might have more resources and afford a 2nd lumber camp right away but I would say initially you should stay on 1 lumber camp. #3 priority is get 3 on gold, to get constant production from 1 range you need 4 on gold but often you see 3 because wood is prioritized a bit more and if you mix a Skirmisher every now and then, 3 are enough. Don’t forget that to click to Castle age you need to be accumulating gold, so you want to add gold vills at some point (you should have 4-5 for 1 archery range and 8-9 for 2 archery ranges - btw I advise against 2x archery ranges as it’s a very noob build that higher elo players know how to counter and fairly situational overall).
After that, you wanna start dropping farms slowly and maybe add a 2nd lumber camp. I would say 10 wood vills for buildings + 2 for archer production is a good number). Remember that to maintain constant vill production you need ~6 on food, berries gather a bit slower so make that 7 to be safe. Which means 4 on berries + 3 gathering sheep. If you pushed 1-2 deer, you should have enough “natural resources” food under TC until at least like 26th vill which is a very comfortable window to start dropping farms.
Overall I would say practice this build 5-10 times and get comfortable with it, it’s better to focus on having the right vills on right resources early than doing damage overall initially because you internalize the build. Also you should have hotkeys obviously for me Barracks is always 4, Archery Range 3 or 4 depending on whether I’m an archer or cav civ so it’s fairly easy to mix army because I bind 4 to MAA production/upgrade and 3 for Archers.
Also very important when you climb to higher elo is asking yourself: is MAA worth it to begin with? This means 2 questions:
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is it good in the matchup? (e.g. if opponent is Burgundians and you are Burmese, MAA is not only your only powerspike until basically Imperial Age but also the only window you have to punish Burgundians eco so you definitely should go for it. You probably don’t wanna do MAA vs Celts or Bulgarians though and go Scouts/straight Archers because Bulgarians for example get free MAA upgrade which is 140 resources they spare)
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is it good for the map? Some people like to wall SUPER early and ultra greed in which case MAA can be a poor choice, which brings us back to the deer topic, you should scout opponent early enough to realize if he is greeding or plans to make army in Feudal, in general if you get fully walled out, your MAA are a BIG waste of resources. Also it goes without saying, some maps are more wallable than others, if opponent got tons of forests, and back berries AND gold, probably skipping MAA can be a good idea (in which case knowing other BOs or knowing how to adapt helps - there is nothing wrong with doing for example a 21 pop archers or not buying the MAA upgrade/canceling it).
In general best answer to an opponent trying to greed to an early Castle age is a few archers, doing minimal walls and going yourself fast to Castle age. The extra wood he invested into walls and idle time + harass from archers forcing house walls should mean you hit Castle age at same time generally.
dont do man at arms untill 1400 elo
just do straight archers instead or straight scouts.
3 Likes
Hm…
If you want maa into archers you will probably prefer to go even 23 pop as it allows you to have a way better eco setup that allows for a lot of different adaptions.
Like walling, making 2 archery ranges, adding more farms, adding a blacksmith…
23 pop also allows for adding a few more early farms which helps having a better distribution of your vills when hitting feudal and in general just having a “healthier” eco behind.
In 1k1 elo I wouldn’t make too tight builds cause you will probably mess them up a lot.
No rules saying people have to play another build, even if it is easier. Playing M@A Archers is certainly a good way to improve if you can do it well.
That’s not bad to do at 1k-1,1k games, I have faced (and do) Men at Arms-Archers with certain success, the key is to control well the militia and keeping your TC producing, also never being housed lol.
I think if anything MAA brutalizes low elo. If anything I wouldn’t do it in higher elo. Idk if 1400 is high enough elo to “adapt” but still in 1100 if you have even remotely good execution, you will get value.
Then again, I see people in 1100 have A LOT of idle TC time (I’m talking like 2-3 min before Castle age click up), MAA make sense only when you don’t have idle TC imo because the main idea is to create vill lead.
23 pop you get 100% walled or you face already 4 Scouts or something like that, nah I think OP should force himself to do the 21 pop, you can do 20 pop even in theory with civs like Bulgarians or Japanese or Ethiopians.
23 pop is def too late if I go up with 23 pop I will do defensive archery range always, you lost all initiative generally.
Do you want to have fun or do you want to win?
MAA is very difficult to execute well, and has many counters, it also needs a high degree of multi tasking. Not only do you need to handle your eco, but make an army while microing the MAA, meaning generally it is advised to only try do MAA at higher elos due to the cost of the MAA, meaning you need to do a significant amount of damage/vil idle time in order to offset that cost
MAA + tech costs 280f + 100g . That’s a lot of food for something that can be stopped fairly easily by the right counter (straight archery range)/can die easily due to mismanagement (TC) or simply get walled out.
Here’s a recent , more elaborate explanation, with a debate around MAA, among other builds :
https://www.reddit.com/r/aoe2/comments/w4fg9p/a_guide_to_1600_a_different_approach/
Disclaimer I main MAA +trushing and do well with it, because I enjoy it. But I can see the problems around trying to do it as opposed to easier builds like scrush or straight archery range(which hard counters MAA btw)